[jicaino]

As per Yamaha nomenclature, here's the BTS -21 project I've started today. I left it where it starts to get tricky (solving the bell notes thing)

 

[paulwl]

An exciting concept - we've seen modernized vintage horns of course (it usually happens to Conns for some reason), but we never get to see the process! I'll be watching with interest.

 

[jicaino]

I have 36 pictures of this on facebook if you want to add me and take a peep.

 

[jicaino]

Or, for my facebook-o-phobic buddies, https://picasaweb.google.com/jicain...ismModernization?authkey=Gv1sRgCMyxhPzt3O76Mg

edit fixed link since fixed a typo in album's name

 

[maddenma]

Or, for my facebook-o-phobic buddies, https://picasaweb.google.com/jicain...ismModernization?authkey=Gv1sRgCMyxhPzt3O76Mg

Thank you.

I do, of course, think you're nuts -- but in a good way. That said, wouldn't replacing the spatula and related keys have accomplished everything you're trying to get here?

 

[smonkman]

Looking forward to seeing how this turns out. Would love to do something similar to my 1918 TT Bari.

 

[maddenma]

Looking forward to seeing how this turns out. Would love to do something similar to my 1918 TT Bari.

On a TT bari, I can certainly see the gain. Not so much on a Big B tenor.

 

[jicaino]

Thank you.
I do, of course, think you're nuts -- but in a good way. That said, wouldn't replacing the spatula and related keys have accomplished everything you're trying to get here?

Thanks. I also think I'm nuts. Not sure about the nice way or not :twisted:
Re replacing the spatula and such: there's a couple of big drawbacks to the old simple 2 long stacks arrangements, wich is double hinged long keys. You can do good by being a good mechanic (meaning, do good stuff with your mechanisms) but the separate G key is really an excellent add on. I'd have liked to have a separate bis Bb key too but I kind of worked around what I got for donor parts horn.

I started out with my old trusty Big B tenor (keys were beyond toast, and for me to say that about the tenor I've liked the most in my life it took a long time) Posts were severely worn, norton butchering along the years didn't make anything better... Then I find me (Thanks Jaye!) a Vito stenciled Yamaha 21.

The initial plan was to cut the main body in half, offset the RH tone holes to match the layout of the selected (more like found cheap) keywork, relocate the bell tone holes. I've done an alto this way. Then as I was starting to undo the solders of the donor, I realized a couple of things about geometry.

I don't know bout you guys but I do hate to play on offset RH horns. I find that if I like how my embochure angle is, one of the wrists is in an unnatural position. Then I realized that if I worked around keeping the bell tone holes on the left, I didn't have to offset the right hand to get a nice clearance to make things happen. I took advantage of the modern hinging and post geometry (improved) keeping the dependable in line TH arrangement.

Earlier this evening when I finished soldering what the pictures shows, I realized that IMHO this "design" (arrangement) is more convenient than offsetting the RH. If you offset the RH you have to play with the bell way to the left to keep a good right wrist position, but then you find that the upper stack is "twisted" out more than it should, making your left wrist uncomfortably extended. With this kind of mechanism soldered on a straight TH main body, you get both wrists to be relaxed and pinkies in place, you have plenty of room for your RH index/middle/ring fingers, you don't need to be "pinching" the keyboard if you have long fingers. Hinging the left pinky from the center of the instrument instead of from behind gives a more positive action and comfortablier feel, I'll be using sort of a reverted 400's THC arrangement on low Bb and B. And man, the body position you can get out of this horn... low and central, without having to bow to reach for the neck, the shoulders needing not to rise or move on unnatural angles... the tryout of the feel made me just be more antsy about finishing this project.

Not needing to offset and unbalance everything because of the "balanced action" (RH bell tone holes placement) you get plenty of "room" on the horn. Check it visually: a modern mechanism never looked neater.

Looking forward to seeing how this turns out. Would love to do something similar to my 1918 TT Bari.

Me too! I just hate that I have to start on a new batch of customer's horns on monday :bluewink:

 

[jicaino]

progress of the day: left the bell keys figured out. Arranged the bell keys levers. Still have a lot to do, but it's surprisingly advanced for a total of 9 shop hours dedicated to this project. I'm hanging it on the wall until I finish some more customer's horns. Not going to even look at it for the rest of july.

there's 20 pictures of today's progress on FB or picasa, pick your poison.

 

[paulwl]

progress of the day: left the bell keys figured out. Arranged the bell keys levers. Still have a lot to do, but it's surprisingly advanced for a total of 9 shop hours dedicated to this project. I'm hanging it on the wall until I finish some more customer's horns. Not going to even look at it for the rest of july.

there's 20 pictures of today's progress on FB or picasa, pick your poison.

Bad news good news. Anyway, good work so far!

 

[jicaino]

just had a better idea for the left pinky keys. dang! it's going to be hell having the idea and not the time to execute it. It's going to have a more armonious design. (and look better)