[arya44]

Hi there,
I'm wondering if someone could comment on comparing sound and workmanship of Borgani vs. taiwanese curved soprano saxophones.
There are two used curved soprano sax options, Orpheo (LA Sax Kim Waters) around $500 to $700 and Borgani around $800 to $1000.
Do you think it's worth it to pay more for Borgani?
Thanks!

 

[Jeff Foster]

Yes.

 

[jlima]

Go for the Borg!

 

[JayeLID]

I am guessing the Borgani is an older one, because if it were a late odel it'd run a hecka lot more than $800-1000.

I third the Borgani, even if it's a vintage one they were very well-made and sweet-sounding horns.

 

[docrob]

If you are looking at Ebay, note that the shipping on the Borgani is $140.

 

[Mikeysaxcat]

Borgani sopranos have a very big sound. Some curvies have a few sharp notes but nothing you cant fix with a little embouchure adjustment. I have a black nickel straight one piece Borgani soprano and it plays great.

 

[arya44]

I'm in Canada. Shipping is $30. Just one thing to be happy about over here... I guess.
By the way, it doesn't have high F#. Is that still pro horn or student. Do they even have student models?
I'm wondering about the gold plate. On the left pinky keys, it looks more like a worn out lacquer. But I'm not an expert so may be it is gold plated.

 

[arya44]

Thanks for your feedback. I dropped the idea of getting the Taiwanese ones unless I bump into one that I love the sound and the intonation.
Cheers.

 

[milandro]

As Jaye said this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Saxophone...225?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item460a7c8c29

is an older Borgani, at present I don’t think they make any curved soprano and they haven’t done so for some time. I have had a couple of these and they are good saxophones but with a somewhat unsophisticated mechanics compared to a modern curved soprano. Comparing this model to a modern production Borgani (straight or semicurved) is a completely useless exercise, they are different saxophones.

Because it has a modern Borgani Logo my guess is that this wasn’t sold too many years ago. The owner says it is a 1999 model. If that is the case this is an updated version of the same curved soprano that they had in the ’70.

Also the Left palm keys are considerably newer in shape than the ones that I have had. It has front F and Bis keys too. Also the owner says this is gold plated (looks like it is).

The price is, in my opinion, extremely attractive. Would I buy this instead of any of the other mentioned sopranos? Yes I would BUT with the caveat that this hasn’t the same versatility and operability that an newer soprano has.

 

[arya44]

Would I buy this instead of any of the other mentioned sopranos? Yes I would BUT with the caveat that this hasn’t the same versatility and operability that an newer soprano has.

Thanks for the info. I have a 1920's Wurlitzer curved soprano sax. So I imagine it will be a step up for me by means of comparing the mechanical design. Also the Wurlitzer is up to key of Eb rather than the Borgani up to key of F. I don't know if this will be an issue once I have a good handle on the altissimo notes.

 

[JayeLID]

The thing about vintage Sopranos is....they were made up until the 30's then vanished completely until around the 60's. This has been discussed in other threads. No major maker made 'em in the 40's-60's, unless by special order.

So there will be a significant difference between a pre-'40's horn keyed up to Eb and a 70's one keyed up to F. IMHO, there isn't really as significant a difference between a solid 70's model and a contemporary one as far as playability. Some extra keys, maybe....

 

[swperry1]

Borgani serial numbers are pretty much useless prior to the Jubilee series that have a "J" in the number, and the new "OB" line. Mikeysaxcat, Glad you're still enjoying the soprano! I talked to a couple people at the Borgani factory via email when I was interested in the soprano that Mike now owns (I bought it VERY lightly used). They told me about the poor record keeping and random use of serial numbers, They also said that the horns made in the few years before the Jubilee Line (Late 97-99ish) varied a bit in design/ mechanics, and there were a lot of different finishes than they usually offer. These were like test or prototype horns for the soon-to-come Jubilees. It's very possible that one of the design ideas was for a curvy. The case, logo and engraving style are a perfect match between the two horns (Mike's and the curvy). Mike's is a great playing straight soprano, and the finish is a beautiful pearly black with gold plated key work; EVERY key is serial #'d to match the horn!

 

[milandro]

As I said this is the very same design that Borgani had used in the ’60 and ’70 and it belonged to that era and not to the modern Borgani times when this brand acquired international recognition, it has slightly updated keywork but then they didn’t carry out this old design into their new production.

I agree that a soprano like this is a different beast than a ’20 soprano and one only has to listen to Jan Garbarek playing his Santoni (which might have been manufactured by Orsi) to hear what kind of sound these horns are capable of.

The keywork of a more modern soprano , in my view, is just a little more advanced and sophisticated but yes, that doesn’t necessarily count as a reson to discard one of these horns.

 

[arya44]

The price went up too much for my pocket so I let it go
If someone else from SOTW forum bought it, once it arrives please reply to this thread about the intonation. Massimo (the seller) mentioned it is not like Yamaha by means of pitch definition and accuracy, and it is more like vintage saxes but it is flexible (I think he meant adjustment with embouchure).
Well, I guess I'm back to the drawing board. Do you recommend I create a new thread asking for comparing the Taiwanese saxes or we can take Borgani out of the picture and continue comparing LA Sax vs. Cannonball vs. Antigua, etc?
What is your experience with a Taiwanese curvy? Should I avoid it if I'm worried about the pitch? Which one gives a more vibrant tone?
Thanks and congradulation to the winner if it is one of the SOTW members.

 

[docrob]

Arya44

Can you give a ballpark price range?

 

[dogster]

my Phil Barone curvy is excellent and i have it for sale because i love the Tenor more

 

[arya44]

Well, I have to sell my Wurlitzer curved soprano. I can afford putting the money on a line of credit for a short time assuming I can pretty much make the same money on the sale.
It is from 1920s. I had a thread asking questions about it. I'm not a pro or even intermediate player so I felt it takes me time to find the right pitch on the tuner with that vintage sax.
Apparently pro players do the pitch adjustment on the fly but I thought if I upgrade to a more modern sax with good intonation I will have easier time. I really love the intimacy of the curved saxophone but I don't know if I can get a modern curvy with good intonation for the same price as the Wurlitzer. I think the Wurlitzer sells around 800 to 1100 dollars. The original owner was thinking it's about 950 dollars worth but then I heard it could be less and then I saw a few adds in the range of 1400 or 1500 dollars so it's hard to say.
It is a Buescher stencil based on the thread below.
This is the link to the thread http://forum.saxontheweb.net/showthread.php?182600-Soprano-Sax-Problem-with-Highest-Lowest-notes
and the photos: http://www.flickr.com/x/t/0090009/photos/[email protected]/
By the way, my thread was prior to taking the sax to the shop. I took it to Twigg Music in Montreal soon after (August 2012) and they did a great job (they had to change 3 pads and they did some other stuff). It plays from top to bottom. The highest note is Eb.
Some links to the current value:
http://www.music-oldtimer.com/en/instruments/saxophones/soprano-saxophones/112310-wurlitzer
http://www.ebay.com/itm/vintage-ori...oprano-Saxophone-Music-Oldtimer-/170839363407
http://saxalley.com/saxophones/soprano-saxophones.html?brand=288 (As you see, this one has much less price so I really don't know what I can count on).

 

[arya44]

my Phil Barone curvy is excellent and i have it for sale because i love the Tenor more

How much is your PB Curvy? Please PM me.
BTW, I tried to PM you and SOTW forum notified me your PM quota is exceeded and you need to delete some of your PMs

 

[JayeLID]

The thing about your Wurlitzer is it only keys up to Eb, which decreases its value. You should be able to get about $600-700 for it in today's market. 2 years ago, $1000 would have been a legitimate expectation.

That's a pretty old horn so indeed it may have some intonation issues. A '60's-'70's Borgani, not so. I have sold a few Borgani curvies. They are pretty in the pocket intonation-wise.

A budget contemporary soprano is a bad idea, you may just end up switching seats in the same section, intonation-wise....so looking for a more reputed modern mfr. such as Barone is a better call.