big bore/big chamber, small bore/small chamber?

1931 Views 14 Replies 8 Participants Last post by bfoster64, Oct 11, 2007

Jolle

Discussion Starter · Oct 9, 2007

I've noticed while trying out mouthpieces, that there is a big difference between my old Selmer Signet and my new Chicago Jazz Series in responsiveness with the same mouthpiece.

My own BergLarsen Steel 115/2/SMS responds great on the Selmer, but is more difficult to play, especially in the low register, on my CJS. The sound is great, but it requires a lot more control.

On the other hand, trying a Lebayle jazz (great mouthpiece by the way!) I noticed it played beautifully on my CJS, but had a boring sound on my Selmer. I didn't buy it (yet), I want to try out some other ones before getting me a new mouthpiece. But it's defenitely a candidate, more than the dukoff I tried (honkin' only), or the Meyer (far too classical for me)

I believed I read something here about an influence of the bore on the size of the chamber optimal for that saxophone. Is there any mouthpiece specialist willing to shine a light on this? It would help me in my search for a new mpc, as it can narrow the search.

Thank you in advance.

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bfoster64

· #4 · Oct 9, 2007

I'd love to see an informed answer to this question as it has occurred to me many times when comparing mouthpieces on my B&S and Buffet SDA tenors, only to find that some pieces play great one one horn but not the other.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the SDA generally has a bigger bore that the B&S. The B&S seems to have a fairly small or modern bore until you get down to low C#, C, B, and Bb, where it sounds more like a Keilwerth or a large-bore horn.

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bfoster64

· #8 · Oct 9, 2007

And there's the rub. Once you start comparing bores, you realize each part of the sax, from neck, to body, to bow, to bell, needs to be looked at.

Regarding the bow on an SDA, it doesn't stick forward as much as say, a Keilwerth's, but doesn't it extend down a bit further?

I've often wished someone would make a catalog of 3-d graphic models of the bores of each horn, if only to satisfy my intense intellectual curiosity about how the shape of each horn matches up with the differences in sound that I hear when I play them! You could superimpose the graphics on each other and get a visual on even the most subtle differences.

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bfoster64

· #15 · Oct 11, 2007

I read the FAQs on Mojo's site, and I particularly like the way he explains how changes in chamber effect changes in intonation in different registers of the horn. I've read the Yamaha article by Stephen Duke on "Pitch Center" a number of times, which focuses on how embouchre effects intonation in different registers, and I've seen other explanations and discussions of the relationship between chamber volume and intonation, but Mojo's explanation was so concise and made it crystal clear.

To quote:

The effect of too large/small a chamber volume on intonation is not all that difficult. If your chamber volume is too small, you will (hopefully) find yourself pulling it out on the neck cork in order to increase the chamber volume so you can tune the mid-range of your sax. This lengthens the distance from the mouthpiece to the tone holes of the sax. The % increase in length is greater for the high notes than the low notes. Thus your high notes will be flattened more than your low notes. The high notes will be flat and/or the low note sharp when you tune the mid-range. If the chamber is too large, the opposite happens. This could fix an intonation problem or create one.

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