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Hello Sotw. I am trying to understand some of the music theory and help my playing to a better way by using approaching chords over other chords. For example the IIm V7 approaching chords to a Imaj. Found on the net and used on a piano many variations of adding other chords on a major system 2 5 1 like for example : " Dm--->Ab7---->G7--->Db7--->Cmaj---->Ddim --->Dm....and cycle.
This example for example sounds good to my ears and there are many others i have tested.
But looking for the same approaching chords on a minor 2 5 1 i havent found anything yet. Lets say we have a 2 5 1major to a relative minor 2 5 1 : " Dm G7 Cmaj ----> Bm7b5 E7b9 Amin"" what chords would you suggest between Cmaj and Bm7b5.
What approaching chords would you suggest between the whole 2 5 1 minor system like the major i wrote above.

My question isnt about approaching the 2 5 1 minor system only but fiding those chords which sounds great when you want to approach other chords. IIm7b5 and V7b9 are some chords i cant understand how to approach them even individually.
Thank you.Sorry if i didnt wrote good english.
 

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I think once you begin to 'superimpose' other chords and progressions above others, you have some degrees of outness, or flavors, to choose from. So you can use approaches that are harmony based, like
secundary dominants (D7--G7), tritone subs(Ab7-G7)....In this mindset you would have to think the approach chord as the I chord of a tonality. I think the problem here lies in that for our ears the I could be major or minor, or event dominant, but we don't hear a m7b5 or a 7b9 as the I of a tonality. So approaching those like this maybe does not work as easy, at least for my ears.

Some on my ideas over minor 2 5 is to think of equivalent dominant substitutes, specially when working with bebop phrasing. For example, for Bm7b5 i could think of G7 and for E7(b9#9) i could play Bb7(tritone sub), or keep just the E dominant bebop with b9 and b13, for example. Then you can think of approaching those chords G7 and Bb7 like you approach a major dominant.

And one step further is to forget about playing the given 2-5 and think of an 'alternate path'(that term i heard from Steve Coleman) to arrive to the destination, using other logics, like for example, Coltrane changes.

Another way to think is, as i said, degrees of outness. For example, as in Liebman´s book 'Chromatic approach to harmony', some of the examples involve playing 2-5 lines not related to the one you are playing over. For example, you play or think F#m7 B7 over Dm7 G7 resolving to C.

So there's a lot of thinks one can do.

I would like to have all this in my ear-fingers, not only in my mind!

I could suggest a video related to the topic which can help you a lot delineating the approaches...

https://www.mymusicmasterclass.com/...mprovisation-lesson-vertical-language-bundle/

Not free but maybe you're interested. I find it very interesting and practical.

This is a very interesting topic for me, as you can see.
 

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Atratr thank you for your responce. There are many great suggestions for color in your responce! Your idea of sub the Bm7b5 with G7 is new to me(didnt think of it before and makes sence) and am gonna test it to see where it will get me.
Can you describe me Coltrane changes over a minor 2 5 1? Can coltrane changes apply to any chord we want to approach? (major minor dominant?)
As you said my final goal is the outness and flavor!!!! I want to know for every kind of chord if is possible its juicy approach ( Like you are in blues and you play a C+ from C7 to F7!!!!)
 

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Same as a major 2 5 1, however Coltrane changes cycle can be used in different ways also.

So if you are in C major, 2 5 1 is Dm7 / G7 / C or C minor D-7b5 / G7b9 / Cm

you apply coltrane changes:

Dm Eb7 / Ab B7 / E G7 / C(or Cm)

you can play Dm7b5 for the first chord when in C minor.

However i would only think of studying this in major. Or in a modal context. To my ears minor harmony has enough flavor to it.

And for another view, listen to Coltrane´s solo on "Take the Coltrane". I am studying it and you can find fresh ideas with triads(even without going out), angular playing, also out playing, tension and release, all over a blues. Nice balance of tradition and modernity, and very intense. I love it!
 
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