[jfisch]

Hello everyone! Just thought I’d share my oddity of a Martin Alto
Here's what I know so far from my research:
Serial #102227 should put it somewhere around 1930-1933 (I’m guessing 1931) which was when Martin was making Handcrafts/Masters/Troubadours. However, it can’t be a troubadour because it has 3 RH palm keys and all the troubadours I've seen only have the 2. It also lacks the troubadour engraving.
The keywork and positions of the keys are identical to the Master "Typewriter" but as you can see not every key is pearled.
The split bell keys rule out most of the later versions and the low chromatic F# is on the back of the horn which makes me think it’s not a handcraft per se. I’ve never seen any handcrafts (versions 1, 2, or 3) with it not in line with the main keys.
It plays great although it probably could use a tuneup. Seems to be some weird conglomerate of different horns. I’ve been calling it a “watered down typewriter” because I think it’s a master body they had left over but gave it conventional keys. I talked to people on Facebook, Reddit, and even emailed the guy that runs www.themartinstory.net and everyone seems to agree it’s an oddity. My guess is a Master with traditional keywork that maybe someone wanted instead of the “typewriter” keys. Either way it’s an interesting horn that plays great and I’m glad to have in my collection.
Cheers!

 

[sparq]

Per the engraving, it's a Handcraft.

However, I think it's been modified with an added Front F mechanism and a change to the side Bb key - maybe it was missing when repaired.

 

[bruce bailey]

It is just a later HC series 3. They had that side Bb and a front F (after 1928). Probably no rear Eb too. These were made alongside the Troub and typewriter.

 

[jfisch]

Per the engraving, it's a Handcraft.

However, I think it's been modified with an added Front F mechanism and a change to the side Bb key - maybe it was missing when repaired.

What makes you think it’s modified? What should I look for? There doesn’t appear to be any modifications that I can see.

It is just a later HC series 3. They had that side Bb and a front F (after 1928). Probably no rear Eb too. These were made alongside the Troub and typewriter.

Show me a HC with that low F# trill and I’ll be onboard. I haven’t seen any HC, any series, with it wrapped around the body. They’re all in line with the RH keys.

 

[bruce bailey]

The F#, like the different side Bb and possibly no rear Eb was just an evolution that went on the series 3. Think Typewriter without the pearls. Maybe a HC series 3.5? Here are some photos...use the gallery dropdown for the different model photos. The Martin Story - All there is to know about Martin saxophones

 

[bruce bailey]

Somehow that link didn't transfer. Try again: The Martin Story - All there is to know about Martin saxophones

 

[sparq]

I was basing my comment on a close serial number horn on Bassic-Sax Pix, but I'm not very familiar with Martins. I was hoping someone else would chime in with more knowledge of the subject - which appears to have happened.

 

[jfisch]

The F#, like the different side Bb and possibly no rear Eb was just an evolution that went on the series 3. Think Typewriter without the pearls. Maybe a HC series 3.5? Here are some photos...use the gallery dropdown for the different model photos. The Martin Story - All there is to know about Martin saxophones

Thanks for the link and your thoughts. I actually emailed the guy that runs that site some pictures and he didn't seem to think it was a straight handcraft either. Another odd feature is the brace on the neck which also didn't seem to be a feature on the handcrafts and I know the neck belongs with the horn because the serial numbers match. The brace was added to the master and troubadour models.
The pearled octave key was a master/troubadour feature but I haven't seen that on any of the earlier handcraft pictures I've looked at.
When I posted on Reddit I got this response and I thought it made the most sense:

Very curious! I think I have a good answer for what you have there, and it's really interesting. So, my guess is you have a Martin Master Model without the additional pearls. My guess as to why is that perhaps they had a Master Model body that never got sold or something, or perhaps it was a special order. I realize it is slightly too late to be considered as part of the traditional serial number range for the Master Model, but oh well. So here's my evidence.
Martin Handcraft Master Model (Typewriter): American Makes & Models / Martin / Handcraft Master - "Typewriter" / Eb Alto 101356 |
Martin Handcraft "Transitional" Model: American Makes & Models / Martin / Handcraft / Eb Alto 108502 |
Martin Handcraft Imperial: Martin Handcraft Imperial Alto Saxophone (1933)
So if you look at the first example, the typewriter model is, other than the extra pearls and finish of course, identical to your horn. I believe you already made a note of this. Also, the neck design is the same, having the added neck brace, which none of the original Handcraft models had. Also, we know it's not a neck from a different horn, because Martin put the serial number on their necks as well, and it matches the body. Lastly the engraving is exactly the same. While it is true that some of the original Handcraft horns had this design as well, I haven't been able to find a single example of a typewriter model that didn't have that shield emblem and font.
If you look at the second and third examples size by side, they are quite interesting. The second has no discernible markings as an Imperial, and like Handcraft models has a split bell design. What is also interesting is on one of the bands it has "M203" etched on. Is that meaningful? Who knows! The Imperials, as I believe you noted, moved both bell keys to the left side of the instrument. However, the key design is virtually identical, from the auxiliary F# to the sculpted high E. These are features that the typewriter model and your instrument lack. There are likely other similarities and differences between the second and third examples, but I think they suggest that the second one is the transitional horn, and perhaps even a late-stage prototype.
So, what I think this all suggests is that you in fact have a Martin Master Model, just without the "Typewriter" part of the equation. Also of note is that when compared to the original Handcraft models it has no G# trill, nor does it have the fork Eb tonehole. The original Handcrafts had these features. The Master Models did not. So yeah, seems like you have quite an interesting horn! If only it could talk...

Long story short... without some kind of Time Machine I don't think I'll ever have a good answer. All I know is that it's a wonderful horn that will stay with me as long as I can still put air through it.

 

[turf3]

Keep in mind that Martin were not concerned about maintaining clear delineations between different models. They were in the business of making stuff and selling it. They didn't care that people 90 years later would be obsessing over whether this key matches with that model. And when you went to the music store to buy a sax, they might have "the Conn saxophone", "the Martin saxophone", "the Buescher saxophone", etc. Maybe two of each. You didn't go "but the catalog shows the key round the back and this one's on the front" - you played the thing and if you liked it you bought it.

Furthermore, Martin more than most makers had a tendency to dicker with their designs and they made mechanical changes about as often as you and I make sock changes.

I'd say if it says "Handcraft" that's what it is.

 

[jfisch]

Keep in mind that Martin were not concerned about maintaining clear delineations between different models. They were in the business of making stuff and selling it. They didn't care that people 90 years later would be obsessing over whether this key matches with that model. And when you went to the music store to buy a sax, they might have "the Conn saxophone", "the Martin saxophone", "the Buescher saxophone", etc. Maybe two of each. You didn't go "but the catalog shows the key round the back and this one's on the front" - you played the thing and if you liked it you bought it.

Furthermore, Martin more than most makers had a tendency to dicker with their designs and they made mechanical changes about as often as you and I make sock changes.

I'd say if it says "Handcraft" that's what it is.

Haha fair enough and that works for me. I'm just glad it's mine and that's all that really matters.

 

[JayeLID]

It's interesting, there are a few features suggeting 'bridge model'...

The neckbrace ? That appears on Martins of a tad later...

Photo Gallery :: SaxPics.com

saxpics.com

....perhaps the last of the HC's, a bridge before the early Handcraft Standard (link above) which has the Front F and the neckbrace....

 

[Tryptykon]

Thanks for the link and your thoughts. I actually emailed the guy that runs that site some pictures and he didn't seem to think it was a straight handcraft either. Another odd feature is the brace on the neck which also didn't seem to be a feature on the handcrafts and I know the neck belongs with the horn because the serial numbers match. The brace was added to the master and troubadour models.
The pearled octave key was a master/troubadour feature but I haven't seen that on any of the earlier handcraft pictures I've looked at.
When I posted on Reddit I got this response and I thought it made the most sense:

Long story short... without some kind of Time Machine I don't think I'll ever have a good answer. All I know is that it's a wonderful horn that will stay with me as long as I can still put air through it.

Thanks for the link to the Reddit topic and bassic-sax.info link.

I have a 109,896 s/n HC split bell tenor like that. altho' in dark lacquer instead
of that gorgeous silver plate - a little outside of the range for HC tenors, I guess .

Series 3.5 ..ha ha.. I like that .

I also have a Troub' alto 104K and an earlier 89K HC tenor.

I like this period of Martins .

 

[jfisch]

Thanks for the link to the Reddit topic and bassic-sax.info link.

I have a 109,896 s/n HC split bell tenor like that. altho' in dark lacquer instead
of that gorgeous silver plate - a little outside of the range for HC tenors, I guess .

Series 3.5 ..ha ha.. I like that .

I also have a Troub' alto 104K and an earlier 89K HC tenor.

I like this period of Martins .

Dang! Just need a get a bari, soprano, and c-melody to round it out haha! Have you had any issues with the solder on the tone holes? That’s my biggest worry. How’s service been on them? I’m going to get mine serviced soon and I’m scared of what they’re going to find. I mean it plays so it can’t be too bad? Right? Right!? Oh god…
When I’m in the market for a tenor I was thinking of trying to find a same era Martin or a Yamaha 61 tenor.

 

[PigSquealer]

Keep in mind that Martin were not concerned about maintaining clear delineations between different models. They were in the business of making stuff and selling it. They didn't care that people 90 years later would be obsessing over whether this key matches with that model. And when you went to the music store to buy a sax, they might have "the Conn saxophone", "the Martin saxophone", "the Buescher saxophone", etc. Maybe two of each. You didn't go "but the catalog shows the key round the back and this one's on the front" - you played the thing and if you liked it you bought it.

Furthermore, Martin more than most makers had a tendency to dicker with their designs and they made mechanical changes about as often as you and I make sock changes.

I'd say if it says "Handcraft" that's what it is.

I’ll add to this. The serial number dates to 1931. After the big market crash all kinds of funky things happened. Sometimes whatever parts were on hand to make a complete unit is how it turned out.

 

[Tryptykon]

Dang! Just need a get a bari, soprano, and c-melody to round it out haha! Have you had any issues with the solder on the tone holes? That’s my biggest worry. How’s service been on them? I’m going to get mine serviced soon and I’m scared of what they’re going to find. I mean it plays so it can’t be too bad? Right? Right!? Oh god…
When I’m in the market for a tenor I was thinking of trying to find a same era Martin or a Yamaha 61 tenor.

I do have a Comm. 1 Bari that needs an overhaul . Used to have a 68K HC sop that I sold
to a SOTW member probably 15 years ago. I miss that one and have thought of
getting another -- beautiful sounding sopranos.

No issues with the toneholes so far . They're solidly built instruments, IME ..

 

[bruce bailey]

That neck brace appeared along with the typewriter

 

[turf3]

I've had 4 different saxophones with soldered tone holes. One of them (a very abused Holton soprano, not a Martin) has some trouble, due I believe to nearby solder repairs. I just sealed up the tone hole joint with some nail polish and it's still fine 20 years later. I believe the issues with soldered tone holes are way overblown, though they do exist in some cases. Quite honestly I have known several Martin players as well, and I don't think a one of them has ever had an issue either.

A quick pass with a leak light will tell the tale.