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I got one!! - a 1925 Holton Revelation C, satin silver, burnished inside bell and keywork, with Master Keys. Original mouthpiece (nice) and case (not nice). It arrived today.

If I never believed in haunted objects before, I do now. It had taken me two tries to get this one, so I was excited to find the horn had arrived safely (being very over-packed) via 2nd day mail. I opened the box, took out the case, sat down on the living room floor, and started trying to open it. The flip catches flipped, but the spring latch wouldn't spring. The button shifted easily, so it wasn't locked (even if it was, I have a key that works on every luggage lock ever made) but it would not give, not a millimeter. Then, suddenly, it popped open - like it hadn't been stuck at all! Inside was musty, as expected. I looked in the compartments and found some accessories and the maroon bakelite Holton Perfected (Patent Applied for) mouthpiece. I decided to clean that up first, but the cap was jammed down on it tight, so I set it aside for later.

The Holton appeared to have had an uneventful two days in transit - until I noticed one of the RH side keys looked weird - the C, in fact. A C with a bad C. Crap! I thought, wiggling the disconnected rod. A whole 5 minutes and 23 seconds of horn ownership, and I'm gonna have to return it! NOOOOOOOOoooooooo!!

But wait - maybe - yeah! Maybe it's in the case! And there it was, down behind the cushion along the back, in with all the lint and threads and little crumbs. I pulled it out, and just as I saw it was in fact the screw I was looking for- - - it was gone, sparkling for a millisecond as it lept, laughing, from my fingers and vanished into the carpet fibers.

Carefully, I ran my hands over the spot where I thought - where I knew - it should have landed. Nada. I checked further around. Still nothing. I stood up, checked my clothing. Satisfied it wasn't there, I went to the tool cabinet for a magnet. Upon my return, I tested the head of another screw on the horn. Ah, ferrous metal indeed.

I got on my hands and knees and rubbed the magnet across the carpet, then up and down, and back across again. I slid the magnet around in the case (found an old paperclip), then tilted the case back and ran the magnet underneath. I checked on the opposite side, where the horn lay on floor. I sat back down, and ran the magnet over my socks, in case maybe it was caught on the bottom of one, but no joy. Back to the carpet again. Placing the magnet back on the the floor, I brushed slightly against the open case with my other hand. This time it took offense. The lid slammed down; the hook edge of the spring-latch became a giant tooth. The case bit me. It took a second longer than it probably should have to realize the latch was actually embedded between the first and second knuckle on the back of my middle finger. It took another second for my finger to turn purple and start bleeding.

Fifteen minutes later and still stinging from the antiseptic, I walked from the bathroom as I wrapped the fabric knuckle bandage securely over the case-bite. On the way back into the living room, I said to the horn, "I don't know why you're mad at me. I went out of my way to get you for my first horn - well cared for but also well used. Someone played you a lot back then, so I know you're a good horn. Good horns don't live in closets. You'll get a lot of attention from me, too."

I knelt back down to renew my search efforts for the rogue part. The very second I started moving it across, I heard the tiny click of the screw finding the magnet. Well! That's more like it! Three minutes and a tiny tech screwdriver later, the key was good as 90 years ago.

From there it took about an hour: cleaning up the mouthpiece (the cap was mysteriously unfrozen now); messing with the reeds I got (tenors and bass clarinets, both cheap just to see what works); and figuring out where I put the new, clip-ended strap I got last month at one of the pawn shops. Now it was getting close to dinner, but I still took time to get a feel for the keywork, and actually played some notes - I was amazed how easy it plays (no embouchure hardly at all compared to clarinets!) and what a gorgeous low end there is. This ol' Holton may play on the current pads, but there's for sure a repad in the cards for the near future.

I even tried out a long tone (I promise to practice them every day so I can do better next time!)

View attachment 243984 View attachment 243986 View attachment 243988
 

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I got one!! - a 1925 Holton Revelation C, satin silver, burnished inside bell and keywork, with Master Keys. Original mouthpiece (nice) and case (not nice). It arrived today.

If I never believed in haunted objects before, I do now. It had taken me two tries to get this one, so I was excited to find the horn had arrived safely (being very over-packed) via 2nd day mail. I opened the box, took out the case, sat down on the living room floor, and started trying to open it. The flip catches flipped, but the spring latch wouldn't spring. The button shifted easily, so it wasn't locked (even if it was, I have a key that works on every luggage lock ever made) but it would not give, not a millimeter. Then, suddenly, it popped open - like it hadn't been stuck at all! Inside was musty, as expected. I looked in the compartments and found some accessories and the maroon bakelite Holton Perfected (Patent Applied for) mouthpiece. I decided to clean that up first, but the cap was jammed down on it tight, so I set it aside for later.

The Holton appeared to have had an uneventful two days in transit - until I noticed one of the RH side keys looked weird - the C, in fact. A C with a bad C. Crap! I thought, wiggling the disconnected rod. A whole 5 minutes and 23 seconds of horn ownership, and I'm gonna have to return it! NOOOOOOOOoooooooo!!

But wait - maybe - yeah! Maybe it's in the case! And there it was, down behind the cushion along the back, in with all the lint and threads and little crumbs. I pulled it out, and just as I saw it was in fact the screw I was looking for- - - it was gone, sparkling for a millisecond as it lept, laughing, from my fingers and vanished into the carpet fibers.

Carefully, I ran my hands over the spot where I thought - where I knew - it should have landed. Nada. I checked further around. Still nothing. I stood up, checked my clothing. Satisfied it wasn't there, I went to the tool cabinet for a magnet. Upon my return, I tested the head of another screw on the horn. Ah, ferrous metal indeed.

I got on my hands and knees and rubbed the magnet across the carpet, then up and down, and back across again. I slid the magnet around in the case (found an old paperclip), then tilted the case back and ran the magnet underneath. I checked on the opposite side, where the horn lay on floor. I sat back down, and ran the magnet over my socks, in case maybe it was caught on the bottom of one, but no joy. Back to the carpet again. Placing the magnet back on the the floor, I brushed slightly against the open case with my other hand. This time it took offense. The lid slammed down; the hook edge of the spring-latch became a giant tooth. The case bit me. It took a second longer than it probably should have to realize the latch was actually embedded between the first and second knuckle on the back of my middle finger. It took another second for my finger to turn purple and start bleeding.

Fifteen minutes later and still stinging from the antiseptic, I walked from the bathroom as I wrapped the fabric knuckle bandage securely over the case-bite. On the way back into the living room, I said to the horn, "I don't know why you're mad at me. I went out of my way to get you for my first horn - well cared for but also well used. Someone played you a lot back then, so I know you're a good horn. Good horns don't live in closets. You'll get a lot of attention from me, too."

I knelt back down to renew my search efforts for the rogue part. The very second I started moving it across, I heard the tiny click of the screw finding the magnet. Well! That's more like it! Three minutes and a tiny tech screwdriver later, the key was good as 90 years ago.

From there it took about an hour: cleaning up the mouthpiece (the cap was mysteriously unfrozen now); messing with the reeds I got (tenors and bass clarinets, both cheap just to see what works); and figuring out where I put the new, clip-ended strap I got last month at one of the pawn shops. Now it was getting close to dinner, but I still took time to get a feel for the keywork, and actually played some notes - I was amazed how easy it plays (no embouchure hardly at all compared to clarinets!) and what a gorgeous low end there is. This ol' Holton may play on the current pads, but there's for sure a repad in the cards for the near future.

I even tried out a long tone (I promise to practice them every day so I can do better next time!)
When you get it repadded, inform your tech that the beast is haunted!
 

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I hope you're kidding.
There is no such thing as ghosts.
There is no life after death.
Only death after life.

Your horn is not haunted. It's just another relic from the past, with little value. Though I suppose if you could fool someone into believing it resonates supernatural forces... you might get an extra fifty bucks for it.
 

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Actually there is most certainly afterlife... as well as other realities and threads of existence besides/beyond our own.

(Plus, Holtons DO resonate supernatural forces. This is why they have their cult following. But don't go spreading that everywhere, we like our secret.)

But all in all....your (OP) experience sounds to me like a usual eFlay unboxing...including getting injured :blackeye:

Horn looks like it is in nice shape. Is it engraved "Revelation" tho ? Because I have never seen an opp-side bellkey Revelation.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I hope you're kidding.
There is no such thing as ghosts.
There is no life after death.
Only death after life.

Your horn is not haunted. It's just another relic from the past, with little value. Though I suppose if you could fool someone into believing it resonates supernatural forces... you might get an extra fifty bucks for it.
You give out spoilers to the kiddies at trick or treat, too, don't you! :bluewink: lol!

Of course it's not possessed or anything if the sort. Just having a laugh and a fun story. Better than just moaning about lost parts and the case slicing my hand! Please, Grumps, smile today! You will see more joy in life that way!
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Horn looks like it is in nice shape. Is it engraved "Revelation" tho ? Because I have never seen an opp-side bellkey Revelation.
No, not engraved Revelation. I'm basing that model designation on a combination of the serial number and Holton literature.

The lists have my SN squarely in mid-1925, the first year for this model. That's late enough to expect leftover builds from the previous model year are out of the plant. My horn is more than 2000 SNs down the road from introduction.

Also, the 1925 Holton Talent Test booklet introduces "The New Revelation" line as their flagship saxes. Each model gets a full page. Page 18 (click on 15 here: Saxophone.org Holton Publications) is devoted to the C Melody - with a picture of a split-bell horn exactly like mine.

Normally, I would take this with a grain of salt. They didn't have instant digital composition tools, so it was more common than not to see artwork reused for several editions. But it would be a spectacular marketing faux pas to introduce your latest and greatest with recycled images of last year's horns!

These points are reasonable circumstantial evidence that, at least in the beginning, there were split-bell Revelation examples available.

<Edited to clean up poorly phone-typed post>
 

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Alright! I'm glad you found one and it looks like a dandy! I'm going to throw in a vote right now for white pads with your overhaul. I had my nickel-plated Conn NW tenor overhauled this year and opted for white pads and it looks reaaaaally good.

Let's invite Grumps to our Rudy Wiedoeft seance on Halloween. We'll make a believer out of him one way or another. He'll need to bring his own Holton, but he's got plenty of time to pick one up.
 

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great story!
 

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Alright! I'm glad you found one and it looks like a dandy! I'm going to throw in a vote right now for white pads with your overhaul. I had my nickel-plated Conn NW tenor overhauled this year and opted for white pads and it looks reaaaaally good.
Waaaaay ahead of you there! Definitely going with the white pads - they're the cats meow! I honestly think the current "tan" pads look positively pumpkin orange with the satin silver/burnished silver treatment it has. Very undignified, those.


Let's invite Grumps to our Rudy Wiedoeft seance on Halloween. We'll make a believer out of him one way or another. He'll need to bring his own Holton, but he's got plenty of time to pick one up.
We should practice, then - - -

Summoning Rudy!

knock
.
Rudy, are you there?

knock
.
.
.
ping . ping . ping


bumpity
.
.
bimpity


 

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No, not engraved Revelation. I'm basing that model designation on a combination of the serial number and Holton literature.

The lists have my SN squarely in mid-1925, the first year for this model. That's late enough to expect leftover builds from the previous model year are out of the plant. My horn is more than 2000 SNs down the road from introduction.

Also, the 1925 Holton Talent Test booklet introduces "The New Revelation" line as their flagship saxes. Each model gets a full page. Page 18 (click on 15 here: Saxophone.org Holton Publications) is devoted to the C Melody - with a picture of a split-bell horn exactly like mine.

Normally, I would take this with a grain of salt. They didn't have instant digital composition tools, so it was more common than not to see artwork reused for several editions. But it would be a spectacular marketing faux pas to introduce your latest and greatest with recycled images of last year's horns!

These points are reasonable circumstantial evidence that, at least in the beginning, there were split-bell Revelation examples available.

<Edited to clean up poorly phone-typed post>
Wow...thanks, and that's great printed evidence you came up with there. Never knew the model name was used so early on....
 

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Nothing quite like a possessed Holton. I love a possessed Holton. Especially when they are possessed by me.;)

Wow...thanks, and that's great printed evidence you came up with there. Never knew the model name was used so early on....
I have yet to see a sax engraved ” Revelation ” although I do have a recently acquired 1927 trombone with revelation engraved on bell. It is my understanding that the Rudy Wiedoeft and Revelation names ended becoming Collegiate about 1930 ish.



QUOTE=Keshr;4000164]No, not engraved Revelation. I'm basing that model designation on a combination of the serial number and Holton literature.
The lists have my SN squarely in mid-1925, the first year for this model. That's late enough to expect leftover builds from the previous model year are out of the plant. My horn is more than 2000 SNs down the road from introduction.
Also, the 1925 Holton Talent Test booklet introduces "The New Revelation" line as their flagship saxes. Each model gets a full page. Page 18 (click on 15 here: Saxophone.org Holton Publications) is devoted to the C Melody - with a picture of a split-bell horn exactly like mine.
Normally, I would take this with a grain of salt. They didn't have instant digital composition tools, so it was more common than not to see artwork reused for several editions. But it would be a spectacular marketing faux pas to introduce your latest and greatest with recycled images of last year's horns!

These points are reasonable circumstantial evidence that, at least in the beginning, there were split-bell Revelation examples available.
<Edited to clean up poorly phone-typed post>[/QUOTE]


Don’t listen to Grumps. Burn some sage next time you open the case. It will help rid the room of evil smell spirits. When you put the instrument away place some garlic in the bell. That will keep them away.
Good research on finding that name in print. I never thought to look at C melodies for the name revelation.
Our fellow member La Porta has a very accurate serial number list. Some of the list floating around on the Internet are incorrect.

https://www.saxontheweb.net/vintage/Holton-1917-1979.pdf

If the pads have a sewing stitch in the middle they may be original. Love the mouthpiece. A rare find.
Enjoy your Holton it’s a nice one.
 

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Bell with revelation, about a 1927. Click twice on the picture. It will open full-size and facing the correct direction
 

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Discussion Starter #19
1. Nothing quite like a possessed Holton. I love a possessed Holton. Especially when they are possessed by me.;)

2. I have yet to see a sax engraved ” Revelation ” although I do have a recently acquired 1927 trombone with revelation engraved on bell. It is my understanding that the Rudy Wiedoeft and Revelation names ended becoming Collegiate about 1930 ish.

3.Our fellow member La Porta has a very accurate serial number list. Some of the list floating around on the Internet are incorrect.

https://www.saxontheweb.net/vintage/Holton-1917-1979.pdf

4.If the pads have a sewing stitch in the middle they may be original.

5.Love the mouthpiece. A rare find.

Enjoy your Holton it’s a nice one.
1. Yup!!

2. I saw one picture on eBay of a Revelation engraved sax, but I can't find it anymore. I should probably start saving some screenshots for research files...

I'm not sure if the Revelation and Wiedoeft models exactly became the Collegiate line. There are parallel catalogs for Collegiate and Revelation that do not reference each other, running from 1931 up to at least 1936. In 1932, the literature has a new "Professional" model as the top of the Revelation line (click on 30 thru 39 here for 1932 saxes). This is the first illustrations I found of same side bell keys, and a removable clothing guard. When they go from names to numbers, the 210 (and later 211) C-Melody is still in the lineup through 1935. There are three models of trombones, btw (since you have one of them) in the same 1932 booklet: Professional, Revelation, and Symphony. By '37 they merged the catalogs, but still separate the entries for Collegiate from other Holton brands.

3. Thank you for the working copy of LaPorte's Holton list. The link in most of the threads here is broken. I used the old thread and the SN list at Saxophone.org, which is pretty close to it.

4. No joy on the original pads; it came with tan rivets. There will be some new pads in the next week or two, though. I wanted to wait until early next year and do the historically correct overhaul with reso-less plain white pads, but the current ones have started to disintegrate since I have been playing on them. One split and fell out yesterday while I was working on scales, so I will have to settle for good ASAP, perfect later. I measured the errant pad and emailed MM for some samples.

The pad is kind of odd (maybe? I'm used to fixing clarinets, so maybe this is normal for old sax pads? eh?). There isn't any backing, just a cardboard ring around the outer edge, and a tiny oval sticker "63". The felt is exposed in the middle, and has a small area of lumpy shellac smudged on it. The cup is almost clean where it came off, so there isn't part of the pad or any thing in there.

5. I really like the Perfected mouthpiece. My horn isn't stuffy or dull-sounding at all with it. I'm hoping to get another one as a backup, since the one I've got has some little hairline cracks. Perfecteds have been seen on at least 3 horns on Goodwill this month, plus several on eBay. They were also branded as Harwood, Henton, and others, so if I keep watching, I should be able to get a spare. I saw some other good looking mouthpieces I might like to have, too, that are listed or sold recently (a Chedeville C (?!)). This is a dangerous hobby!
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Bell with revelation, about a 1927. Click twice on the picture. It will open full-size and facing the correct direction
Wow! That looks like a museum piece! Very sleek in silver...
 
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