I play alto. How is the bariitone?

[Charlie Parker]

I play alto and it has a really nice, unwaivering sound. I am looking to start Baritone some time or another. How is the tone in your opinion? Some people claim that the sound of the Baritone sounds like "farts". Please clear this up.

[Subtone Sam]

Hey "Bird",it really depends the way you play it;I guess you could make it sound like farting if you wanted to :lol: There are lots of great bari players who can make it sound whatever they want to;it depends on the player,nothing wrong with the bari as an instrument.

[RS]

One of the great things about saxes is that each one has it's own unique character. That's why alot of us (sax players) play more than one sax (apart from doubling requirements to get work). Bari can sound like farts, chainsaws, etc., or it can get a rich mellow sound. It can whisper softly or it can roar like a big cat. It can play fast and nimble like an alto (check out some Pepper Adams), get a gutbucket R&B sound like a tenor (check out some Ronnie Cuber), or lay down a big fat foundation for a sax section or a big band to ride on top of (check out some Harry Carney). The only downside to bari is lugging the behemoth around (but carts or handtrucks can make this easier).

[Bootman]

Bari aint big, Bass is the Behemoth, bari is just the righ size for everyday use. Nothing else sounds and plays like a Bari, the King of saxes.

[RS]

Bootman--what do you use to lug that bass around? A forklift?

[justbari]

Kings of Saxes.... I like that! Seriously, bari is my absolute favorite sax sound. I thought I was a tenor guy a while ago. Bought a few tenor records and even had a crappy pawnshop tenor to honk on. But when I bought an album called Dakar with John Coltrane, Pepper Adams and Cecil Payne I was SOLD on the bari sound. IMHO, absolutely nothing beats the sound. Soft and sweet like Gerry Mulligan or Cecil Payne to biting and honking like Pepper Adams or Nick Brignola. Jump blues like Leo Parker, blues guys like Kaz Kazanoff and Doug James....

Yeah, you can make it sound like farts or a chainsaw but if you listen to Mulligan it's sweet and woody. Rest assured you will not be pigeon holed with bari. The sound really depends on the mouthpiece (and the horn too). You wanna hear some Bird tunes on bari? Mulligan does a version of Ornithology... Brignola and Pepper do a KILLER Donna Lee and Marmaduke (on Baritone Madness)

I say try out a few baris and see what kind of sound you get. Also, check out some of the artists I listed. Listen to the variation in their sounds (plus how different each player can make their horn sound). Don't forget Ronnie Cuber, Gary Smulyan, Harry Carney, Serge Chaloff... who did I miss?



justbari

[saxmanic]

These postings are music to my ears (no pun intended). I too was alway a tenor guy, but every time I picked up my bari I couldn't put it down. I think I hear in the bari range much better too. One thing about the bari I love is thatit sounds so different between artists and can give you such a variety of sound. I have a Mark VI low A and Couf Superba I low Bb and love them both. I also love vintage Martins. To me, Serge Chaloff played the bari most like an alto, although Pepper is my favorite. Glenn Wilson is not as wall known as others, but played a great deal with Pepper and is a monster player. Really beautiful sound and lines. I'm with the Bootman, the bari reigns supreme.

[Gandalfe]

Although my main horn is the alto, I too am fond of the bari. When our bari player doesn't show up I can often be found playing one. I use my son's Yani 990 with the low A, which is an easy playing, sweet sound.

[JPrince]

Well, I am 18, been in band 7 years, and of those 7, 6 have been playing the Bari. I agree, the bari can do anything you ask it too if you want it too. King of saxes? I would DEFINATELY agree with that. I mean, I am a big guy. An Alto is a kids toy, and I look awkward holding one. A Tenor is closer, but a Bari is a perfect fit (I wonder if I should put on some more pounds and get a Bass.....hmmm j/k). I used to use my school's Yamaha YBS-52 (a wonderful horn for general work, but no depth to the tone and you can't blast....well, blast as far as Bari's go). But now my '57 Martin (Thanks again Frank!) can really whisper.... or be heard all over the place, hehe. Man, at our next jazz band gig, during my Bari solo I bet I don't even get miked..... not that I'll need it of course.... lol

[BandNerd]

I'm an alto player, but I've played the bari a lot, mostly in jazz band because we don't have any other experienced sax players, and the others can hack it on the alto parts but they can't switch over to bari. So, I got volunteered. ;)

It's neat, but it takes a LOT of air. It's also really improved my alto playing a lot.

I vastly prefer the alto, but the bari would run second. ;)

[MBushaw]

It takes a different mind-set to be a real bari player. On alto, you get some great lead lines, often playing the melody. Tenor gets the solos. Bari gets- well bari often doubles the bass bone. Sometimes gets to play in the sax soli sections. And sometime, every so often a piece comes along that has a bari line that can make or break the whole piece. My favorite example is Li'l Darlin' by Neal Hefti. Doing that slide down to low Bb in the first section just gives me chills! If you have the talent to find those important bits, and learn to hit them just right, then you can make it as a bari player. Then you can dream about playing the Pepper Adams part in Mingus' Moanin'.

[Morry]

I'm mainly an alto player, but end up needing to play tenor in sections. My tenor skills leave a lot to be desired, although my goal is steady improvement. The most fun I've had playing, though, have been the times I've played bari. You always just seem to be in your own zone when playing it. Hopefully, I can pinch pennies enough to buy one again soon, although I have absolutely no practical use for it. :lol:

[markieg]

I mainly play alto b/c I can't afford a bari. I played bari all the time in high school and loved it. You can get a really rich, low sound almost like a bassoon with more volume and I think it's great. The real problem is when you hit the octave key the sound gets really thin...... But I think that completely defeats the purpose of playing bari. As a bari player your "responsibility" depending on the song is to play the nice soothing low parts, nice warm long tones, or in a faster song you get the mean low commanding role. I enjoy them both thoroughly. I think the bari is the most fun, but there are not a whole lot of solos included. Good luck!

[puresaxman]

:o the bari is a great sax but if you are low in air supply try a smaller horn. Must be big winded to roar on a bari. I started playing bari in 8th grade which was 23 years ago now. I have always loved the bari and always will. I have a vintage bari a wurlitzer lyric silver plated from 1918 and it has a beautiful sound. Praise to all of you bari players!!!!!!!!!! :D :D :D

[Joseph Boucher]

I've played Alto all my life, except the first 8 years and I'm 54 now. I think the Alto is the greatest thing since Mama Sax had a baby boy. But I have to admit that the Bari really cooks. The thing is, that now I can afford one, I just don,t think I have the lung power to play it. I'll admit it...I'm jealous of you Bari cats.

[justbari]

Well I'm only in my mid 30s but I have asthma and can get along on bari just fine. I only started playing too. Except for a very brief stint fooling around on tenor many years ago, bari is my first horn. I never did the alto to tenor to bari thing...

I say, if you want to try bari but are worried about how much air you've got, don't worry. Give it a try...

[Joseph Boucher]

JustBari, I think I'll go shoppin. At least try some out.

[singlereed]

Bari is a breeze to play as long as you don't have any leaks. Sure, you can throw a lot of air down it and I sometimes forget when I play a bari part, and find I have used my air before I get to the end of the note on the page. The speed of the air is lower than a smaller sax - I am a bit asthmatic, and its soprano that can paralyse me, never bari. I have found the hardest one to get an even scale out of has been tenor, whilst I play it a lot, its the one that suffers from being left - but whenever I get my bari out, I find it's great to play immediately. I would add a rider - like any of the saxes, the bari does repay a lot of practice, and *great* bari players would put me to shame, but I think its easy enough to play it competently.

[JaRcKoToPp]

To answer your question, no. The bari doesn't sound like farting. However, if you really wanted it to, you could make it fart. However, usually you get a really big and beefy sound, or a really small sound. If you get a beefy sound, good job! If you get a small, wimpy, sound, blow with a lot more intensity and most of all, increase the volume of your air. Bari is not an instument to be trifled with! I can outplay our entire rank of sousaphones (yes, I march bari). If you want a farting sound, consider playing tuba.

I used to play alto several years ago, and then I switched to bari. At first, I found that bore size was really different and I had trouble with my emboucure being too tight and the notes going up an octave. But I got over it in around a month. Now my heart and soul lies within the bari sax. I recently bought a Selmer Serie III Matte Lacquered Alto, and, athough it's a great horn, I'm going to sell it and buying a Yani B-901 or Conn 12M. The Serie III is great, but it just ain't a bari! As CyberSax puts it: If you love to play bari sax (me), and have been fortunate enough to play really good ones (me again) you know what it is to just play and hold the long tones down low so you can feel the vibrations relax your every nerve and muscle. It's a soul filling experience.

Hope this helps,
JaRcKoToPp

[JPrince]

Well, in my jazz band, one time on my old Yamaha, I had to hit that Low Bb, and it sort of farted. It was so loud and splatty that my director stopped us, and asked me if I messed myself and needed to wash up that fart was so loud. Not one of my best moments.... But a good story none the less! lol

[rcwjd]

I have all the main saxes but the bass, but my main axe is my Mark VI bari. I agree with whoever posted that "getting a chill" comment when doing a big band tune like Hefti's Lid Darlin. Nothing compares. In combo work, if there is an alto or tenor player, they love having a bari along with them. It adds a whole new range of expression, blends and doesn't compete, and can make a combo sound a lot bigger. The mouthpiece can make a big difference on air requirements. I use a fairly open piece (tip opening .115) and I'm 52. When I need to coast a little, I switch to a rubber piece with a tip opening on .090. I truly believe that bari is the most versatile of the sax family. When I played in concert band, I often read and played the bassoon parts when we didn't have a bassoon player. How many instruments can play a bassoon part and sound decent and then turn around and anchor a big band, or zip through a jazz combo? Just my 2 cents.

[Storamin]

Alto player for 6 years, bari player for one. Proud owner of a Jupiter Artist. Man, that thing just sings for me like no vintage bari I've tried. My dad looked at me and said "You want that, when you could have a nice Mark IV?". Baris own.

[Goin4DaTone]

I mostly play alto, and some tenor. I used to play Bari, and I love the horn.
I'm going to get back into playing the Bari. I'm using my son as an excuse. He is going for the Bari Seat in his High school Jazz band, He would probably be able to use the school YBS52 if he gets the job, but I figure that it is time for a Bari. I am thinking about going for a Yani 901B, in great shape, for around $1,500.
He is borrowing an old school Conn at the moment. It no doubt leaks, and the upper octive mechanism is suspect, but generally speaking he is getting a great sound in the low register, a bit thin in the upper, but he's getting there.
He has asthma, but with the right horn position, Mouth Piece, reeds he is sounding decent. Playing bari may even help him increase his air flow. Can't wait to get my hands on the Yani!

[electricninja]

I just expanded from alto to baritone myself, and I gotta tell ya that even being able to play a few low rhythmic honks in a song make it totally worthwhile.

My biggest thing was that early on, I wouldn't run out of air in my lungs yet I wouldn't have enough air to sound the lowest notes. That and I squeaked a lot more often than the alto. But all this improves with time.

[hannibal]

After starting on alto and messing around on soprano for awhile as well as playing bari, I've finally listened to my soul and committed myself to playing only bari- the other two horns are sold. I'm a one horn bari man for the foreseeable future.

Part of the reason for this is that I find the bari to be a time vacuum- the thing demands constant attention. After returning from a fortnight's holiday last year I picked up my soprano and it sounded reasonable; the old bari was just plain moody. If I don't play the bari at least every other day, my tone's shot. Anybody else notice this compared to other saxes?

I once had a local pro player who doubled on alto and flute give me lessons. I was playing alto at the time and went out and bought a cheap flute to emulate him. I showed him the flute at the next lesson thinking he'd be all proud and supportive. I'll never forget his reaction- "Kid, why do you want to play two instruments horribly? You can't play the one horn you got!" 8 years later I've finally listened to him.

[bari_sax_diva]

I must agree with the other bari cats about Lil' Darlin--that low Bb (and I know *exactly* what note y'all are talking about) is the epitome of what bari playing is all about. It's ATTITUDE.

You can hide on the bari chair if you want to. Lots of people do, in lots of so-so bands. If that low Bb in Lil Darlin' doesn't show up at the party, only someone who knows the chart is gonna notice. But when it does show, it's breathtaking. The same person who knows exactly where to put that note will also know exactly how to anchor a section and hold up the bottom end of a chord. They'll also know how to blend with an alto lead so a sax soli is perfectly balanced. And when that person stands up to solo, look out--because they take no prisoners. The big pipe can wail with the best of 'em.

Give the horn a try. "Attitude" is contagious. :wink:

-Leanne

[hannibal]

Thanks to comments from another thread, I made a Low A PVC pipe extension doohickey for my horn recently. I didn't tell the rest of the band and just kinda slyly inserted it at the right moment last rehearsal(hey, get your mind out of the gutter). The affect on the entire band was fabulous! They never knew what they were missing before but now that they heard that Low A rumbling away underneath the other horns they love it! Ahh, it makes my tummy go all nice and warm even thinking about that note :D

Hey bari_sax_diva

I'm playing 'Lil Darlin' in a gig for the 1st time this weekend. Never really noticed the low Bb before in that song but I'm going to recheck my score tonight and see what you mean. Only started playing bari in a jazz big band recently, but I have no intention of hiding in my chair, that's for sure.

And I completely agree with the comment about soloing. The big horn just tears it up and crowds dig it. Who says size doesn't matter?

[RS]

I have the Neal Hefti ("he ain't Hefti, he's my baggie") chart for Lil' Darlin' in front of me and there are several low Bs but no low Bb. My chart is in concert key F (key of D for bari) and I believe is based on the original chart. But playing those low Bs at pp ain't no piece of cake. I can sub-tone the low bell tones but it's unreliable so I use a straight tone and try to keep the sound soft and quiet.

[RS]

Also, the leader of the big band I play with counts it off so slow that between "one" and "four" I have time to go to the bar and have a shot and a beer. I mean slow, man.

[bari_sax_diva]

It's the Hefti chart I'm thinking of--the gliss down to the low note in (I believe) bar 4. Could be a low B, now that you mention it--I'd have to get a copy and look. But it's great--three and a half counts into the chord the rest of the band is holding, you get to slide on down to your note. I had a leader who played the chart the same way--I think we took it at about 60. It takes every bit of air I have to control that note at pp without splattering it. One of those charts that lets you know whether your horn is well-adjusted!

Have fun,
Leanne

[DirkW]

I play soprano, alto, tenor and bari. My main horn is the tenor. But, I'd have to say that I get the biggest kick playing the bari. I love it because it sounds so big. It's not for a wimpy player. You need a good stream of air to fill it up. But when you do, you feel it through your whole body.

[hannibal]

Having checked my chart for 'Lil Darlin' it's also Neal Hefti in concert F. Yah, we play it like molasses too. I've got LAY RIGHT BACK scrawled across the top of the page. I know precisely what you mean about that gliss down to low B. The first time we played it I thought I messed up 'cause I was the only one moving when everyone else help tight! I'll make a special point of trying to really hit that bar this weekend...

Which reminds me of something special about bari playing. A lot of songs have that funky one or two bars where the bari is doin' its own thing. Whether like in the standard discussed above or as part of the horn section in a soul band, wherever it occurs it just makes the entire song. I know it sounds weird that just a few extra notes here and there can make such a difference, but non-musicians notice it too!

[electricninja]

Hannibal, you're right on with the bari. Sometimes I play the bari late at night, pounding out every note imaginable. Then I pick it up the very next morning, and it's like I gotta do 10 minutes of warmup just to fight a low A. And I'm 23!

[hannibal]

If playing bari was easy, we'd have everyone doing it, and then it wouldn't be nearly as cool...

My bari is one tempermental fesity 50 year old beast. If I spend too much time with my fiance, the bari gets jealous and won't play well. And vice versa. It's like being in a weird menage-a-trois or something.

I love my girlfriend, but had to tell her recently that I fell in love with my bari first! :D

[JfW]

Well I'm only in my mid 30s but I have asthma and can get along on bari just fine. I only started playing too. Except for a very brief stint fooling around on tenor many years ago, bari is my first horn. I never did the alto to tenor to bari thing...

I say, if you want to try bari but are worried about how much air you've got, don't worry. Give it a try...

Asthma can be to your advantage:

unless you are in an attack, you can utilize those muscles of the diaphram that are far superior to an ordinary person's to your advantage.

[woodwindmaster06]

Bari is fun to play, it is not hard to control and you get a great big sound it is fun to play and I would reccomend it to everyone.

[tubbycub]

I have always been an alto and tenor player and is known for that but I never really enjoyed playing the bari, mainly due to its parts. I enjoyed playing running notes and melodic lines but not basslines.

There seems to be a problem with everyone in any band I played in. They are always tempted to throw me into the bari seat. The reason they had was I that they had a strong envisioning of me being a bari player. Yes, I am short and fat (5'6 210lbs) but does size really matters when it comes to instruments? The small pettite people get to play the alto, the tall people get to play the tenor while the fat ones always nearly ended up with the baritone. :x

Has anyone of you ever face such size relativity issues?