XLR to 1/4" Cables?

[13thNote]

Hello I have recently started to use a delay pedal in a very LOUD rock and funk band. microphones and anything electic is new to me. My question is what is the best way to run it. I currently use a shure 58 mic and I run XLR from the mic to 1/4" to the guitar delay pedal. From the pedal I run 1/4" out and 1/4" into the PA. Is going from XLR to 1/4" going to reduce the quality of my sound? Somebody was telling me somthing about the 1/4" being unbalanced... and so on? Also can anyone give me any tips on using monitors and the best way to set them up? Thanks

[saxboy]

There are threads here covering these questions. I would do some looking first and then try to get specific questions from there.
In an earlier post on this topic...

GEAR, set up and monitors


You can make these racks huge and very expensive and cool too. My tour rig in 95-98 was 2500.00 in just custom wiring and set up alone. Two 4 space racks all hardwired with ... who cares. Sounded amazing and was, but travel expense involved as a sideman had it home most the time and eventually pulled apart with a few tears. 10-12 Grand at purchase to get together.

Then there was the rig I used 1 time with Peter White before it was stolen. Wireless mics and wireless in ears; it was sounding great and I could hear myself everywhere, all the time, in stereo with great effects. Now gone too… 5 Grand pulled out of trunk and gone.

So what is really necessary?

I have a little 3 space short rack this week. It has a ROSS 1 space, 6 channel mixer with 2 band EQ, effects and Aux sends and Pan on every channel. Very basic and about 300.00. I have the Lexicon MPX200 ? effect in the rack and that’s it. I did have an open space and added a Korg Tuner to be able to see pitch if it was not hearable. Set it up on the aux send from the sax channel and it works great but is totally an extra, non-essential piece.

Set up?

I have channel 1 on the mixer set for Phantom Power to use my clip on AT mic on. I have been just leaving that channel alone because the clip needs phantom and a very low gain since it is a very hot output.

I have channel 2 set for a standard mic input – vocal, bari sax mic, or other.

Channels 3-4 are open now but I did have a Alesis Quadraverb in the rack at first and used these channels for…

Channels 5-6 are effects returns for the lexicon. Mixers do have returns for effects but you only have control over volume if you use them. Channel controls allow adjustment of volume also, but also Pan (are you going stereo or mono, 1 or 2 cables into the PA) so you can turn a knob from stereo and mono. EQ lets you fix the sound of the reverb on the spot. The verb sounds to bright tonight, turn down the highs on the channel instead of trying to reprogram on the lexicon on the gig.

The only problem using channels for effects returns is possible feedback. If you have the FX send on the Channel turned up on the same channels you use for returns, that will cause feedback. That’s one of the reasons I like to put the returns on the far end of the mixer so I don’t screw up.

The lexicon uses ¼ inch cables in from the effects send on the mixer and ¼ inch effects out that go into 5-6 on the mixer. Some effects have mic ins and outs but smaller mixers don’t support it so it does not really help anything.

My mixer is a Ross. It does not have XLR outs so I did buy a pair of DI Boxes to send the PA an XLR signal. You can use little adaptor cables but I don’t really trust them for durability, sound or proper signal matching.

If this sounds too hard or confusing, a quick recap.

My rack has a little mixer and the Lexicon 200. I plug my sax into the mixer and mix effects by using a couple of channels on the mixer. This is the most basic, cost effective sax set up that gives you control over your sound and the effects before plugging into a PA System.

You asked, “what do you suggest and would would you use for your own monitor in such situation?”

EONs are good and easy to use. I tend to like 12 inch rather than 15 inch speakers because the sax does not need a ton of low space; not even a Bari. A 12 Inch speaker should be more friendly in the Mid Frequencies where most of your sax tone and range is found. I think the EON 15’s might have more power which could help. It is a matter of your ear. You want a monitor to encourage, not discourage your playing. Either would be a lot better than a keyboard amp.

I have lots of gear around the house so I have options when I go out. I bought some great sounding monitors made in So. Cal. from A3. I have been using them with a power house QSC amp; mid-line and around 700 watts a side. I am very happy but this stuff was pretty expensive and sounds like it. If I want to go light, I bring the amp and a set of small Ramsa speakers and put them on stands behind me. If I’m late and lazzy I use a Boss powered monitor on a mic stand off one side of the mixer and send the other side to the PA. This works fine and is really small and light; works great if you are using a good PA with the band.


Feel free to post again with further questions raised by these comments.

SAXBOY

[Paul Coats]

I have never used a "transformer for XLR to 1/4" phone plugs.

There are three connections to XLR. The cable has a wire braid shield, and two inner conductors, usually color coded black, and white or red and white. Those are your "balanced" hot wires.

On the 1/4" phone plug end, simply solder the braided shield to the ground, and EITHER the black or white inner conductors to the ground also. The other wire is soldered to the tip connection of the 1/4" plug.

This has worked fine for me for XLR low impedance mics into effects.

As long as the cables are not excessively long, you will not have a problem with hum.

Paul

[Balladeer]

In addition to sax, flute and clarinet, I have been playing electric guitar in bands for 3 decades. I'm very familiar with the electronic side of things.

My suggestion is to use an XLR to 1/4" transformer into the delay and a 1/4" to XLR transformer out of the delay. This will add $30-35 to the cost, but it will reduce hum/noise and allow you to run longer cable lengths to the mixer. Though quite useable in a loud band, these delay pedals are made for guitar, and elec. guitarists do not want as clean a sound as a wind instrument, keybd or voice. The most clean effects units are the rackmount units.

BTW, you ought to try a digital Chorus like the Ibanez or Boss pedals. You could place the Chorus in front of the Delay with a short 6" guitar cord between them. The Chorus will give you that sound that you can hear on INXS. It's somewhat like a group of saxes playing in unison.