Who to play to: the owner or the audience

[Mango Birkie]

I play alto and tenor in a duo with a piano. We play a combination of standards, jazz classics (In Walked Bud, This I Dig of You, etc.), latin/bossa and some originals. We have a couple of different set lists that we use depending on the audience. A couple of weeks ago, we played for the first time at an upscale bar/restaurant that draws big crowds. It's the best money we've ever had for that kind of gig. We were located in an area with a large size bar on the left and dining on the right. So what do we play? We finally decided to go with a dining set in the first half (not as loud, about 40% ballads) and a bar set in the second half when the people eating were mostly finished (louder, more up tempo, maybe 10% ballads). We based our selection on the audience reaction. The diners expressed a desire to hear more ballads and requested some specific ones. The people at the bar were more interested in hearing the music over all the talking. The feedback we got from the owners (who really listened to us for about 3 minutes) was that our sound and presentation was great, but we should have a "peppier" mix. We like playing at this place (we have booked several more dates there), and we want to be regulars. How do we best insure that: play to the audience or play to the owners? Anyone else ever been in this dilemma before?

[Steve J.]

Play to and for the person signing the check. After that primary concern is established, make everybody happy to the best of your ability. If by chance any conflict arises, play to and for the person signing the check. You may then politely communicate that you are trying to accomplish what you were hired to do. The restaurant customer can always make their preferences known to the owner who can then respond in whatever way he (she) chooses. Its not really a dilemna to me its a constant.

[58tenor]

On a different note... Play to the audience. If they dig it, they will spend more money at the establishment, bring their friends, stay longer,etc. This is what the management like$. It's a business. Working an audience is an art. Talk to them for a moment after every few tunes. Give a little background on the upcoming number-whatever.

Most bar/restaurant owners do not pay much attention to the music. They're busy working. They are not in the same frame of mind as the patrons who want to relax and have a good time. You're lucky if they really even listen for 3 minutes. They look at the receipts at the end of the night. If the money is coming in you will have gigs.

Owners are notoriously unscrupulous with bands. It's almost a joke. Make sure you get a written agreement if things get going. This gets into a whole 'nother area. Good luck!

[Bill Mecca]

very true, to draw a parallel, I dont know how many times I've heard stories of video clients demanding the producer do something (play certain music is the parallel) in a video, and then complained that the video was ineffective when it was done (getting rid of the band since bar $$ was not what they wanted)

its a delicate balance. most club owners/managers will gauge the crowd to see if they are enjoying themselves, if they are you are part of it. they will also listen to the volume level, but that is a whole 'nother thread!

[Chris S]

I always play to the audience. A gig is a gig, but if you develop a following... *your* audience will follow you around. That's how my band works, doesn't matter if we play at a bar, upscale restaurant, or in the park.... we have regulars that will show up wherever we play. Also, if an owner knows that your group will bring a crowd... then they'll hire you regardless. They don't care about the music, they care about you bringing people with money into their restaurant. That's their bottom line, what's yours?

Chris S

[gary]

My approach is to schmooze the owner/client by letting him know right from the outset that I am there to give him what he wants, absolutely; it's his nickel. The next step is tactfully showing him how it is in his best interest, "getting what he wants", to let me work the audience and if I am successful, that it makes him look good. As long as I keep people at the bar drinking or the dance floor packed, I've never had a problem. There are, to be sure, uncompromising AH's but I would say I've been successful no less than 90% of the time. Most of it is in how you approach the client.

As an aside, I understand the value in developing a fan base, but when someone is paying me to play what they want, my loyalty is to them. If I have no intention of valuing that committment, I won't take the gig.

[Steve J.]

As an aside, I understand the value in developing a fan base, but when someone is paying me to play what they want, my loyalty is to them. If I have no intention of valuing that committment, I won't take the gig.

exactly.
It 90% of the time will all fall into place. The one paying usually has a goal in line with making the audience happy. If by chance there is a conflict and you side with someone other than the payee it is very unprofessional.

[tbone]

Sadly there isn't a pre-requisite for intelligence when someone buys a night club! Back in the 80's (dang I'm getting old!) I was working in a rock band. A local club owner decided to go rock to try to increase business. She booked eight rock bands for a total of three months worth of gigs. It worked. The place was packed almost every band night and the till was overflowing. The staff was fat and happy too. After the three month she decided that she didn't like her clientèle so suddenly she switched to Country & Western. Within two weeks the place looked like a morgue. Three months later she's going broke and hires rock bands again. This cycle went on like this for about four years until all the rockers got together and boycotted the place. Next thing you know she's a bartender in someone else's club! 8-)

Sometimes you have to make the club owner think it's their idea! ;)

[saxymanzach]

Depends on who is paying you more.

[LarryG]

We like playing at this place (we have booked several more dates there), and we want to be regulars. How do we best insure that: play to the audience or play to the owners? Anyone else ever been in this dilemma before?

Seems to me that if the audience is happy, they will ask the owner to "bring those two old guys back to play", (sorry, I couldn't resist, and you know I am almost as long in the tooth! HA), and the "following" will become the leader. But ultimately, make sure the guy/gal paying the fee is happy. Nothing makes a bar owner happier than a packed house.

Hey Mango, where is this place? I have to get up and see you sometime...

Regards

[Dr G]

Well, it could happen that the owner has been there a while and is successful. He may know the music he cares to hear and knows what pleases his clientele in the long run. Just because a few audience members are vocal enough to express their preferences, doesn't mean that they represent a consensus.

For me, if it's good music, I listen. If it is a good presentation, I stay through dinner and listen some more. I don't know that a slow set during dinner would convince me to stay for another set. I'd listen to the owner and try a peppier mix - until you've played a few weeks there, you won't know the place. If you don't listen to the owner, you won't make it through the first few weeks.

[jaysne]

I like what Phil Woods once said: "I don't get paid to play; I get paid to show up." Meaning that the owners have no idea what he is doing. You may get a few jazz afficionados in the crowd, and once in a while an owner who appreciates the music, but how many people listening really and truly understand what this master musician is doing as he re-invents music every night? The owner just wants him there because he puts fannies in the seats; the people enjoy listening to the music. I say play to the crowd; if they're happy, then management is happy.

[Tim Price]

Do what you do and do it THE BEST YOU CAN DO...within what is needed in the club.

Do what you do...and do it with STYLE AND CLASS. Put in 100%.

Thats all you can do....the rest is hard to control.

100%.

[Iddo]

Play to yourself, is an option I didn't hear.
When my band is booked, I assume that the person that booked us know what we sound like. The reason for me of being in a band, is to play what I want, what I feel, and what I like. If I didn't, I would be either in a standard rock band or a smooth diner jazz combo. I am in neither. So I do no bother too much with expectations.

Of course there is some stretching; some songs can better be excluded from certain sets etc., and intentionally trying to **** the owner off is something that is not very smart in any case, but at the core I think a self-respecting musician (that's really in it for the art, not for the money etc.) should not bother too much with what either the public or the owner expects.

Of course, when you're in a low-key standards combo, your goal is somewhat different: You want to entertain, you STRIVE to fall in a certain category. But in this case your whole reason to play is drastically different.

I am in a band that likes NOT to fall in any category. Of course sometimes we do more or less, but it is not our goal. As a result, sometimes it's harder to get gigs or to please the crowd, but at least we stay true to ourselves and we are constantly psyched about the musical energy that keeps us going.

I'd rather be in a band that kicks ***, and covers new ground and not get much paid than be in a band that gets loads of cash but has to fit into a straightjacket.

There you have it.

[Frank D]

We finally decided to go with a dining set in the first half (not as loud, about 40% ballads) and a bar set in the second half when the people eating were mostly finished (louder, more up tempo, maybe 10% ballads). .........The feedback we got from the owners (who really listened to us for about 3 minutes) was that our sound and presentation was great, but we should have a "peppier" mix.

I can't help but think there might be some blurring of the concepts of "fast" and "loud". Try playing more uptempo tunes, but without getting louder. Bossa novas come to mind, although you can play just about any "up" tune quietly. I think that might help your dilemma of pleasing two different audiences at the same time. Once the dinner crowd filters out, you can let 'er rip.

[Hotspur]

Try and find a common ground between the audience and the guy signing the checks.

[RandyJ]

Back twenty years ago (and more) the bands that I was in got booked because of their reputation. After that agents started sending tapes along with the promo packages. Now my agent sends out DVD's of clips.

I play what I play, that sounds a little simplistic but that's what I (we) do. To put this in better context, the “we” is a quartet, quintet, or sextet (usually) and we play more "listening" room type venues.

Personally I feel you have to be true to the music you want to do to be and stay happy in the long run.

[Jbroad572]

Is the owner approachable? Can you tell him what you heard the audience prefers and see if he agrees and will allow you to compromise? If I were the owner, I'd want the audience happy primarily, so if the band knew something I didn't then I'd want to know. I haven't had the pleasure of a gig like that, so it may not work like that in that arena. Just a thought though.