choosing a mouthpiece and new saxophone

[firefighter42]

Hi. I'm extremely new to the saxophone scene. Right now I'm playing an old Yamaha YAS21. It's not in REAL bad shape, but it's definitely used. I'm not sure what mouthpiece is on it, but I was reading that part of getting a good tone and being able to do all the tricks better is getting a nice mouthpiece. I've played piano for about 14 years now, guitar for around 5, and played trumpet for about 5 years as well until I quit, so I've been around musical stuff for a long time. I've been lucky so far and since Monday I've made it through the whole first book of Beginning Alto Sax, the "Essential Elements" series. I can play some songs, and I'm thinking I'd kinda like to upgrade to a better sax sometime soon, since I know that part of learning how to play is learning on a halfway decent instrument. I know learning guitar that when you try things on a cheap instrument that don't work well b/c of imperfections that aren't existent on more expensive instruments, such as the tone from a Squier Strat vs. an American Deluxe Strat with the S-1 (for those of you that know about guitar). Right now I'm still working on getting my tone consistent and completely eliminating squeaks. I'm using a Vandoren 3 Reed right now as well. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

[Martin Williams]

The Yamaha sax you have is an excellent horn for beggining on, and I think most people here on the forum will agree with me (many will probably say it is the best). I do however do have a few suggestions

1) Get a softer reed, a 2 1/2 should be great, it will make playing a lot either.

2) Take the sax to a good tech and have him make sure it is adjusted properly, (i.e. it has no leaks, everything is straight, etc) this will also make learning easier, more fun, and more rewarding.

3) For a good starter mouthpiece, there are a few good places to start. the stock Yamaha 4C piece is great, ands so is the Selmer S80 C*, and the Meyer 5M. Also look at the Premiere by Hite, a pretty good piece

4) Get a teacher and take at least a few lessons to get yourself started. A teacher can help you remedy problems you may be having, suggest different things to try, and most importantly stop bad habits before they start.

Also, when exactly did you start playing the sax, it seems that even with previous musical background monday might have been a little fast. Make sure you aent rushing through the books, and are working on tone production, scales, longtones, etc becasue developing good habits is very important.

Martin Williams

[goodsax]

If, as your user name suggests, you're a fire fighter, I for one appreciate that service. Second, welcome to the sax-playing community. You could be in for an interesting and enjoyable ride. Martin already has done an excellent job of answering your questions, and others may add their ideas, but I just want you to know that by being here at the SOTW forum, you've come to the best place for answers to all your sax-playing, maintenance and buying questions. The SEARCH function is especially useful for finding discussions related to specific terms and key words. Lastly, if you start buying mouthpieces now you'll find it a very slippery slope that leads to becoming mouthpiece poor and still playing not much better than you did with the first one...well, maybe that's a bit of an exaggeration.

[firefighter42]

Thanks for the warm welcome. I'm a college student majoring in Aviation, but on the weekends and breaks and stuff I'm a firefighter to help fund the flight stuff (thanks Goodsax). Getting a teacher, although the preferred method, is probably not going to happen for me due mainly to time but also money. My mom is a band director/music major from college, and she gave me some very general tips monday evening. The book really I believe is probably meant more for beginning band students instead of individual private lessons. It has a few full band arrangements in it which are obviously useless to me. Basically all I used it for are to learn the fingerings for the different notes and to play some of the songs out of it. Obviously due to time I haven't learned any real scales except for the Concert B Flat. I looked around the house for something to play out of and all I found was a hymnal, and I can squeak my way through some of those songs. haha. When I went to my guitar shop to buy a reed, one of the guys there gave me a 2 and a 3, and told me to try both. The 2 sounds better at the moment, and is much easier to play with, but I can get halfway decent sounding notes out of the 3. What would be some examples of bad habits I should look for? I've done A LOT of reading on the internet, mostly on this forum but also on other places. I've seen some people that said you should only use the octave key as an aid to hit higher notes, some that say that your embrouche (sp?) should be the same to play the entire range of the instrument, and yet others that say you should be able to do it both ways. Seems to me that the octave key is there for a reason, so for the moment I decided that I should try to do it that way. I'd say there are leaks somewhere, because there seems to be a lot of air noise and/or minor vibration on some notes, but others are very nice sounding (considering my experience level). I've never practiced anything as long at one time as I have sax. I've literally played till my lips and jaw muscles are hurting. Having played trumpet I'd say that saxophone is the same in that you have to build up muscles. I'm very open to suggestions (as long as they're cheap. haha.) I'm not expecting to be a pro, I'd just like to be pretty decent.

[Martin Williams]

At this stage in your playing, I would suggest you continue to use the octave key. Most the people I know didnt start trying to use the embrochure to do that until we were slightly advanced students. Stick with the 2 or a 2 1/2 reed for now, until make it a lot easier to build up your 'chops'. Once you have them built of though, alot of educators would want you to move up to a 3, probably after at least of year of playing.

Good Habits to have include would be make sure your embrochure isnt to tight/loose as to put you out of tune. Also, dont try to rush your learning. Stick with basics first and get them right before you move on. There are a ton of others that other people can add, but those are big ones, IMO

It shouldnt cost a ton of money to have any leaks taken care of on the horn. The mouthpiece, if you are going to replace it, expect to pay about 50 bucks at least (Ebay may be a good place for you to find a good one used).

Also, I still think you should get at least 2 or 3 lessons if at all possible with a good teacher because they will be able to quickly stomp out and physicaally show you how to correct any bad habits you may be forming before the become a real problem

I think thats everything you asked for now! lol keep postin with your questions!

Martin Williams

[fballatore]

The mouthpiece, if you are going to replace it, expect to pay about 50 bucks at least (Ebay may be a good place for you to find a good one used).

Also, I still think you should get at least 2 or 3 lessons if at all possible with a good teacher because they will be able to quickly stomp out and physicaally show you how to correct any bad habits you may be forming before the become a real problem

Martin Williams

Used mouthpiece on eBay? Yuchhhh.

Now about your next point. That led me to wonder about something I really hadn't thought about.... How long will I want (need) to take lessons? I just took my first lesson Wednesday, and I'm prepared to take as many lessons as I need to, but I'm sure that there will be a point where the teacher really isn't teaching anymore. What would you say?

Thanks!

[Martin Williams]

Take the lessons as long as you feel they are helping you, or until you can confidently teach yourself.

Also, no matter how long you take lessons, your teacher will have SOMETHING to teach you. Also, you will learn things in the most unexpected places, including the 5th grade begining band student!! In general though, I think it is necesary to take a minimum of at least a half dozen lessons when begining mainly to prevent the development of bad habits and to set you off on the right foot.

Martin Williams

[fballatore]

OK, thanks Martin. I was planning on taking lessons for at least a year in any case.

I just noticed your age - you have a great amount of knowledge for an 18 year old. How long have you been playing?

[Martin Williams]

Thank you VERY much for the compliment!! I have been playing since I was in the fourth grade, age 9. I started giving private lessons when I was a sophmore in HS and give begininng and intermediate lessons.

While I believe I am a pretty good player, I still think there is a Ton I still need to learn. I attribute my sucess playing to having a good suport and ready access to answers to all the questions to my problems; thanks SOTW!!!!

Martin Williams

[Akron SaxGirl]

Hey this was a very informative thread Thanks. I am a beginner in search of a teacher. I am in Akron andI think Martin told me to call Akron U before. I called 2 times last week and he never got back with me, I guess its a busy time of year huh? Im gonna call one more time and then I give up. :o Seems like no one wants to teach me and I am sooo afraid Im going to get frustrated and give it up NOT anyway thanks for all the great advice

[imamfaja]

akron sax girl, i'm no pro but I've been doing some web surfing and on www.saxquest.com they have a section where you can type in your zip code or address or something and they will list a few good teachers located near you, so if you're lucky maybe theres one very close to you!
http://saxquest.com/teachers.asp
yeah just type in your zip code in that box and a list should come out for you

[retread]

In addition to the good advice given above, spend a few bucks for Larry Teal's book, "The Art of Saxophone Playing". It's full of tips and techniques to make you a better player. And it starts with the basics.

[Face Ache Mike]

Here`s the route I took as beginner:

Trevor James "The Horn" alto sax (used) - good, solid, student sax. Paid £400.

Yamaha 4c mouthpiece that came with the sax. Worn like hell but better than the TJ mpc.

Selmer S80 C* mpc (new) - woohoo made a massive difference and the peace of mind I wasnt putting something in my mouth that had been in someones elses mouth before.

Rovner dark ligature - mostly for convenience as it only has one thumbscrew.

Rico #2 reeds. I bought 20 from Ebay for about £8 per box of 10. I also bought a 1.5 and 2.5 reed just to experiment but I find the #2 is just right.

The Complete Saxophone Player Omnibus book - covers absolutely everything you need to know. Great motivation teaching you modern songs. Written by Raf Ravenscroft.

The Jools Holland "Music Makers" saxophone tuition DVD (http://www.petethomas.co.uk/saxophone-instruction-dvd.html) - This guy teaches you to play sax in a relaxed, easy to take in, style. I still refer to it one year on.

Team Woodwind Saxophone (book) - Basic, simple instruction. Teaches songs one note/key at time.

About 6-8 "lessons" from a local sax player. Really, these were just a listen to me play and let me know where I can improve type of session.

I now have a Yamaha YAS 62. A big investment but one I don`t regret. I`ve got here within a year of picking up a sax and with absolutely no previous music knowledge thanks to the sources Ive just listed and the help and enouragement I`ve received here at sotw.

[BariSkaJazz]

firefighter, one thing you havent mentioned is listening.

Go grab some CD's man! Go to a concert/jazz club, anything. Its important to know what a good sound is. This will also help you determine what you want to sound like. Thats where mouthpiece selection comes into play. You didn't mention playing in a community band or anything like that, so I'll assume you are playing for your own enjoyment as of now. If this is true, than selecting a mouthpiece should require a little searching, looking for one that helps you obtain your sound. Its very important to have a sound concept in mind. I feel that if you don't have one yet (which isn't a bad thing), don't go rushing out to get a new mouthpiece. As you begin to realize what you want to sound like, then you can start searching for a mouthpiece that aids you in achieving your tone. I would also suggest that when you do begin your search, play as many as you can, try not to play on only 2 or 3 pieces and make your decision. You never know which piece may just be 'the one'.

You've started a long, fun-filled journey, have fun playing!:D

[tomas]

firefighter et al, there is a great way of getting all sorts of wonderful saxplaying on the net. just type in: www.pandora.com. you'll get a form where you type in your favorite artist (let's say ben webster) that will create your "ben webster radio". now all you do is lean back and listen all day long to music of that "genre". you can create as many "radios" as you want. my 2 eurocents, tomas

[gelliot2]

Now, that I like!

[vries1]

Hmm pandora registration requires US residency... :|

[RookTenor]

Used mouthpiece on eBay? Yuchhhh.

My sentiments exactly, which is why I picked up a Berg Larsen METAL mouthpiece for my King Cleveland tenor that I could boil until any cooties, real or imagined, would be quenched. I'm a new player as well and I love my metal mouthpieces.(I have two) I can't imagine playing with a plastic one.

Good luck to you!

[rogerb40uk]

My sentiments exactly, which is why I picked up a Berg Larsen METAL mouthpiece for my King Cleveland tenor that I could boil until any cooties, real or imagined, would be quenched. I'm a new player as well and I love my metal mouthpieces.(I have two) I can't imagine playing with a plastic one.

Good luck to you!

Don't be such a wuss :D

Soap & water + a mild antiseptic and a toothbrush(not one from ebay) will decootify any mouthpiece. There just aren't that many cooty corners in a mpc !

[fballatore]

Don't be such a wuss :D

Soap & water + a mild antiseptic and a toothbrush(not one from ebay) will decootify any mouthpiece. There just aren't that many cooty corners in a mpc !
Since I was the first wuss :D, and having now played for about a year and a half, let me now give my more informed opinion. Roger is absolutely correct. (Frank says after having purchased many used mouthpieces from eBay and SOTW members.)

:D

[Manny3]

Now, that I like!

I like the picture on your name. Is that a picture of Sigord Rachell (I think I misspelled his last name)? If so, is he still alive and playing?

[AlistairD]

Since I was the first wuss :D, and having now played for about a year and a half, let me now give my more informed opinion. Roger is absolutely correct. (Frank says after having purchased many used mouthpieces from eBay and SOTW members.)

:D

Frank,

Please be clear when you say 'many.' I seem to recall a recent thread where you talk about 17 alto mouthpieces.... It certainly looks like you have got over your fear of 2nd hand ones.....:D :D :D :D :D :D