Is the Reference Saxophones Worth it?

[woodwindmaster06]

Do you think that the changes to the Reference Saxophones from the Series III are worth the cost, (plastic resonators, diff bell angle, and new neck) Also note that there is only a $300 difference if you get Brushed Series III

[hodges1]

after testing the new selmers on the market, in comparison to the older selmers, ie, mark vi, super balanced action, etc, i felt a strong difference between night and day for myself individually, the earlier models feeling, sounding, and playing far superior. re-issues are not un-common in the musical instrument industry. however, it is difficult to exactly duplicate the original. the reference tenor is an excellent horn. however, while close to, i did not feel that it was parallel to a mark vi. i do feel that it is one of the best horns on the market. however, a dollar comparison for the price did not justify the means in the investment for me after comparing the prices of competitors such as yamaha and yanigisawa who in some respects were just as good, and in a few respects a little better and easier blowing, and the competitors had some reminiscence to me of the earlier selmers that the newer selmers did not, nor justifying paying the extra money for the new selmer at that point to feel like i was at that point going to pay for just a name. this came after an extensive trial period. it is impossible to re-issue a stradivarius and expect it to be the same as the original, and me as a consumer does not feel justified paying the same for the re-issue as i could going out and buying the original. still, these are the best horns selmer has issued since they discontinued the mark vi, and almost as good as the mark vi, but almost is not as good as was considered when i was looking at the price. i was just as happy with the less expensive competitors and saved a hefty sum of money.

[Reedsplinter]

They is.

[Al Stevens]

They be worth it.

[Kritavi]

I've been playing for over 30 years and have had the chance to try many horns. I owned a Series III tenor for a few months and never felt comfortable with it and never got into the tone, it was set up very well, I just didn't like it. On the other hand the Ref 36 has really surprised me with what a beautiful full warm sounding horn it is. It is an instrument that one can really get deep into, I love it. For me the difference is pretty dramatic.

[newjazz]

hey hodges1, I totally agree!!!!too dam Expensive I feel the reference horns are modified series II's, notice the key work is exactly the same. As I said before, very soon we all will be playing Asian horns!

[Kritavi]

I agree that the price consideration is a big factor and not always justified. Selmer uses smoke and mirrors to explain why these horns cost more. I got a ref at a series III price, there are deals out there.

[Grumps]

As far as tenors go, I'd take a III before paying the Reference premium.

[gary]

I tried them all and they were all well set up. I chose the III tenor.

If I had to do it all over again, I might have tried Ref 54 or 36 necks on the III but I don't regret not doing it. It's just something I didn't do that might've been interesting. heath has gone through a lot of neck-horn combinations and his conclusion was to leave everything well enough alone. So I'm, pretty satisfied with my III.

Regarding the Refs being the same as the III's with a few cosmetic changes that's just not my experience. The inherent sound of the Refs I played were a little darker than the III's and there was an obvious difference in the LH palm key placement.

(This is referring only to the tenors, BTW.)

[BigHunk]

Out of all the tenors I have tried and the ones I currently own, I always go back to my Ref.
Just seems to be the most versitile,comfortable horn for me.....

[Alexk]

Yup, they're worth it.

When I bought my Ref tenor, I was able to try a number of other models, including the 36 and a MkVI. For me, on the day, the 54 that I purchased was the one that played best for me.

[Grumps]

(This is referring only to the tenors, BTW.)
...'cause if it were alto, we'd be telling him to get a II.

[Desax]

Play the Alto and the Tenor, can't seem to stop loving them everytime I play them,,, or do they play me,, hmmm, might be on to something here!

[gary]

...'cause if it were alto, we'd be telling him to get a II.
Good point. My experience was a difference between altos and tenors.

I rated the tenors like this:
Serie III
Ref 54 and 36
Serie II

and I rated the altos like this:
Serie II
Serie III and Ref 54

[amoram]

The answer is very simple:
Yes

[Pgraves]

They is.
Though it wasn't about saxophones, Oscar Gamble said it best, and it applies here:
"People don't think it be like it is, but it do."

[bluesaxgirl]

The Bird Series: Definately not.

[jazzcat58]

personally i found the reference to be an excellent horn,but i dont think its worth the money really?, my mk6 is still a better horn and for less cash i think theres better alternatives out there.
bryan

[Mactenor]

I have a 3 year old Ref 36 Tenor, purchased from and setup by Randy Jones and I personally think that it is a great horn. Love the sound and it is mouthpiece friendly.

[Dr G]

Funny how most of the people that have spent any time playing the Ref tenors like them and the people that haven't played them fail to appreciate them.

[jazzcat58]

Funny how most of the people that have spent any time playing the Ref tenors like them and the people that haven't played them fail to appreciate them.

I certainly did appreciate the ref54 i played, as i said an excellent horn ,but at 3500£ or there about in the uk!, there is stuff out there cheaper and with just as good a sound, thats just my thoughts, i guess if i had more time playing one i would get a ....well more accustomed to it, it was very good.

[Dr G]

I wasn't referring to only you, Jazz', so please don't take personal offense. There are a great many people on this forum of late that are all too eager to give opinions on matters of which they haven't a clue. At least you've played a Ref.

[soybean]

Maybe a better question would be; is our childrens learning?

[RandyJ]

Do you think that the changes to the Reference Saxophones from the Series III are worth the cost, (plastic resonators, diff bell angle, and new neck) Also note that there is only a $300 difference if you get Brushed Series III

Worth the cost should be thrown out of the equation as the Ref horns are just different in sound than the Series III.

Around the middle of last year I began my quest for a new horn, having played MK VI's since the mid 1960's. My play testing included all the 4 majors and 4 of the popular Taiwan brands. I quickly dismissed the Taiwan horn and of the major 4 retested Keilwerth and Selmer again. From those two it ended up Selmer again.
Then I concentrated on the Series II, Series III, Ref 54 and 36, then down to the 54 and 36 (the Series III is just way to bright sounding for me). I played 4 or 5 each of the 54's and 36's from different dealers in the US and the Ref 36 is the horn I loved the most and ended up getting one through Jerome Selmer in Paris. For my tastes it is THE horn and when you find a horn that is so great in every way the cost just does not come into play, I mean they are not 2 or 3 thousand more than the other top professional horns on the market today.

[Reedsplinter]

They is. They still is. I like they.

[jazzcat58]

I wasn't referring to only you, Jazz', so please don't take personal offense. There are a great many people on this forum of late that are all too eager to give opinions on matters of which they haven't a clue. At least you've played a Ref.

Thats fine george! no offense taken,i was fortunate enough to have a few days with one, so i guess i was able to really see what the instrument was all about,absolutely nothing wrong with tone , ergonomics of course! being selmer, very similar to my mk6, in the states you can pick them up for a bargain compared to in the uk.
I think the price tag really bothered me ,saying that the sound was there and if one, thinks its worth the money then they will buy it.
cheers bryan

[goodsax]

I tried them all and they were all well set up. I chose the III tenor...(This is referring only to the tenors, BTW.)Gary, did you have to make any adjustments to a key that opens with the octave key? I know that's a bit vague, but if you had to do it to get optimum playing from your tenor III you'd know what I'm referring to. In one of my dance bands I sit next to an alto player who owns both alto and tenor III's and he told me he had to have this adjustment made to get both of them to play right. I've been searching the forum for something like this, but so far have found nothing.

Rob