Projection. Not the same as Alto and Soprano.

[Shaun SS]

So last night I went to a jam session with another sax player that is a great friend and an incredible player. Anyway, He is sitting about 10 feet directly in front of me. He wanted to hear things before he played.

After the jam he gave me some pointers. Most of which I knew were things I needed to work on, just re-confirmed my own thoughts. He mentioned I have beautiful tone on tenor but I lack projection, the sound stays to near me. I have always felt that I can get my Alto to project really well but my tenor sound has always been confined. He says it only seems to be the tenor as even my new soprano projects really well. Both Alto and Soprano he could hear last night even when I was not playing near a mic but the tenor he could not hear.

I don't really think it is my setup. When he plays my setup, it's got balls and the sound goes. I play his set up and same weak projection.

My setup:
Cannonball BB Tenor
Rovner Deep V 10
Rovner light and dark ligs
Fibracell / 2.5 - 3 or La Voz / Med

What do you find really helped your projection?

[saxchado]

I practice in a concert hall, or any other larfe room that I can find. Too many of us get used to having our sound fill a small practice room, bedroom, whatever, and never learn to fill a large room. Find as large a room as you can, and the deader (acoustically) the better, because you have to really project to hear yourself well.

[Riff]

Tenor does require more air than soprano or alto. However, tenor also offers less resistance, so its easy to lay back and not fill the horn since it blows easier than the smaller horns. Keep an open throat, support the air from the diaphragm and fill the horn up. Dynamics are controlled by how fast you blow the air into the horn, not by how much air goes through it.

And practicing in large rooms does help as saxchado said.

[shmuelyosef]

Joe Lovano gave some great advice at a masterclass years ago: Practice outside and keep your lungs full of air. Really good advice.

[Shaun SS]

Tonight was a big awakening and I think the begining of the change for the good. I have now realized how lazy I have been playing tenor. I got home about 6:15 and decided I needed to work on the sound of the tenor after last night.

I put together my alto and tenor. I first played a few scales and long tones on tenor and it seemed like a fairly big sound. Grabbed the Alto and then the tenor seemed like it had a little less sound than the alto. In the past I always thought in my head it's just because of the length of the horn. As a lot of you know when playing a curved soprano, the sound is right there in your face. That has been my line of thinking.

I thought about how much of alto mouthpiece I had in my mouth vs tenor. It seemed I was putting about the same amount for both. Since the tenor is much bigger, I decided to put more in my mouth. My tone went south. I noticed I was also having some problems in the upper and lower octaves but the mid played fine.

I decided to start with low Bb and make it as big and fat as I could. Opened my throat as much as possible and the sound seemes way bigger than 15 minutes earlier. I started playing scales keeping everything the same but found I was still having problems in the palm key area.

Tightened my embouchure a little and reduced the amount of lower lip I was playing with. Now the palm keys were getting better. Altisimo though was tough to just stab. I realized I was not giving the horn enough air support.

Wow, I was lazy. Now that I know what I am doing wrong, I am going to work on it. My tone isn't the same, but after playing long tones, it started to come back some.

[saxchado]

The work never ends...

PS: did you ever get that lig?

[JL]

Grabbed the Alto and then the tenor seemed like it had a little less sound than the alto. In the past I always thought in my head it's just because of the length of the horn. As a lot of you know when playing a curved soprano, the sound is right there in your face. That has been my line of thinking.

Very odd. I've always found the tenor to have a much bigger sound than either alto or soprano. The smaller horns have a bit more cutting sound, but thinner and not as full as the tenor. At least that's my experience, both from a listening (to other players) and playing standpoint. Which is why I mostly play tenor.

[wersax]

Very odd. I've always found the tenor to have a much bigger sound than either alto or soprano. The smaller horns have a bit more cutting sound, but thinner and not as full as the tenor. At least that's my experience, both from a listening (to other players) and playing standpoint. Which is why I mostly play tenor.
I believe we are discussing two very different things with fullness and projection. The tenor requires some work to get it to project. I've been working in sections and as a big band first tenor a bit for a couple of years (after years of close mic and acoustic work), and I'm here to tell you that it takes a lot to get a tenor to project over an ensemble! Saxchado's and others advice about practicing in a big room is spot on. I love to practice in my den with cathedral ceilings; I do most all of my practicing there. The wonderful thing about the sax is that it has such a malleable tone. Put your mind to it and you can get great projection out of the tenor; look at Lenny Pickett...............

[Dlew]

From wha tI've been told about a tenor where there is no tapering of the neck its difficult to project the same as you would with a alto or soprano. I play in in a gym alot so I try alot of project and I find it comes from the jaw alot more than airflow. Maybe you can try changing embourchure along with an increased airflow might do the job. or where the tenors bell points kinda up you should tilt it a little toward your audience that might help as sound waves will head toward your audience instead of the ceiling.


just some thoughts
Don

[Razzy]

Most of my professors take about the same amount of mouthpiece on ALL their horns, as do I. I take a bit more than most, just about an inch, to compensate for my overbite. It's something to think about.

[Saxn]

Is that the trick to compensating for an overbite?? What I've been trying to do is correct the overbite condition while I play. It works great until I have to play a long gig, and then after about an hour and a half my jaw starts hurting and I start to lose control of the mpc... I'll try your technique for a minute.

[sinkdraiN]

Interesting topic. When I first began to play a lot of tenor I struggled to project in the same way as my alto. Sure the tenor has a bigger tone but piercing through a big band with no mic was never a problem on alto. Tenor was different. The resistance of an alto allows you to really push the air without the tone breaking up. I think the reason why I play a more open mouthpiece on tenor is to replicate the resistance of my alto. Thaat and a lot of support balanced things out for me.