I can't believe this...

[Jimbob]

I was in concert band last year, and now, my sophomore year, I got into wind ensemble. Well... I brought my alto sax with me, thinking everything was going to be ok, and all of a sudden, my band teacher comes up to me and says that I'm going to be playing the bari sax O_O (I'm an alto sax player obviously)

I've never touched a baritone sax before and I'm going to be playing with a bunch of more skillful players. What the heck am I going to do??? :( Is it hard to learn a new saxophone instrument? I play the alto and I know that the bari and the alto have the same notes and everything which is great but... is there any tips for a new baritone sax beginner?

I can't seem to reach the low notes below F I think. The higher note always comes up first then it kind of rolls down to the low note. Do you have to REALLY open up your throat? Ugh I'm just trying to learn how to play this thing before I go back to school.

Thankyou

[HC]

I played alto my first year and bass clarinet my second year. I was asked to march on bari sax.

Long story short, try a softer reed for the lower notes. Also relax your embouschur. The bari requires a lot more air than an alto does. Mess with it a few days and figure out its characteristics and you'll be fine. I enjoyed playing it so much that I bought my own. If you have more questions, feel free to email me. howard0528(at)gmail(dot)com

[bariman]

Just to make sure, but you are sure the sax is in top working order, right? It is probably a lack-of-enough-wind problem, but leaky pads can make a sax, especially baritone, hard to play. You really have to open up that embrouchure and support the air. I agree with HC about the reed, because one like a 3 and up would not be good to start out on. When I first started out on bari, I actually felt right at home with the low notes, having played tenor for a good while. I dare say it was more fun to rattle the room with the Low Bb than to "sing" with the upper register and altissimo.

Bariman

[Brendan Muse]

First of all, don't worry about your level of skill. You're almost certainly perfectly well suited to top-level bari charts, where eigth notes are a novelty, and chromatic runs are to be feared.

As to your playing problems, make sure the horn works well. If it does, the best solution is to take it home and do lots of low long tone work. Also, demand that you use the school's best bari, being that you are in the top band. If that is a Bundy, you're screwed, and we all feel sorry for you.

[Jimbob]

http://www.angelfire.com/oz/omnizero424/badnotes.mp3

I recorded myself trying to play some of the lower notes I'm having trouble with. I have no problem with sluring but when I start off on a low note, I always get that octave sound first. How can I find out if my sax is leaking? I think I'm just having trouble opening up my embouschur. I also can't hold notes for that long. I run out of breath after like 2 or 3 measures. Uh.... I wish my teacher could of told me I have to play bari over the summer so then I could practice all that time.

[Jimbob]

Oops, if you want to listen to my crappy notes, you have to put http://www.angelfire.com/oz/omnizero424/badnotes.mp3 in the URL browser and click go because angelfire doesn't allow direct links from different sites I guess uh..

Oh I have a yamaha, my teacher just gave me a brand new mouthpiece that was like 60$ and she also gave me a 2 1/2 reed.

[bariman]

A yamaha, eh? Those are usually pretty good instruments. If it's an older horn, it might be a 32, but prob a 52, right? As for the notes, It might be a prob. with the pads (need's to be taken to a tech to be looked over), or maybe a problem with the octave pip, but I'm not 100% on that one.

I've never heard that kind of problem. It does sound, however, that your playing lacks breath support. You need a steady collumn of air going through the horn to get a good sound. This means you need to have the same air preassure in the horn in the begining of the note, and during. From what I hear, you lack that preassure in the begining of the note, which is why the tone reverts to the note up the octave. It's kind of like blowing a flute. Anyway, try holding long notes a couple of measures in the upper register to build up a good lung capacity, then try those low notes. Lack of breath support (lung power) is also the reason you are having trouble with holding a note a long time. Since you're not used to the larger bari sax over alto, your lungs are working overtime to get enough air into the horn to make a sound at all. It just takes time, and don't worry, it will come to you with practice and hard work. Good luck...

Bariman

[shmuelyosef]

If you can play down to D2 in the upper register, then your problem is unlikely to be the horn, although the horn may not be perfect. Bari is all about a relaxed embouchre with good breath support. Start with a reed that you are certain is too soft...what mouthpiece are you using (type and facing)?

[Gandalfe]

Try a week of long notes. Do some long tones starting soft and getting loud for eight beats starting with Bb1 and working your way up. Then on day three start with some starting soft and crescendo to as loud as you can get. Also do some tonguing staccato and then legato like dit, dit, dit, dit, and then dah, dah, dah, dah, dah.

Long tones should just be part of each practice session and hopefully you are doing arpeggios and scales. Within a week you should be moving on to transposing some of Gerry Mulligan’s stuff. 8)

[gspiegel]

Simplest way to find out whether the problem is you or the horn would be to try another horn for half a minute.

If that's not possible, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain by having the horn checked out for leaks. A small leak in one of the palm keys could be working just like an octave key for example. That happened to me (I'm also an alto player taking up bari.) I couldn't play a middle D without hearing an A first until I got the leaks fixed. Take it to a repairman and get an estimate, then take the estimate to your band director and explain that a bari with leaks can't be played softly. (grin)

Glenn

[magnus]

I was like that, long ago. Yeah, drop the lower lip - don't force the notes. Let them speak, and think of the note you're going to play in your mind. It will come, easy and light, with plenty of breath support hopefully, and you can go from there. Just think about that D, or C, to yourself, hum it if you must, or come down from G chromatically thinking of the tone of each note on the way down. Should work, and don't worry. It will come and chances are your parts will be too damned easy anyway.

I always got bored on high school bari so I'd ask to double the parts that we were light on. Or coach the tuba players into not sucking.

[Merlin]

Oops, if you want to listen to my crappy notes, you have to put http://www.angelfire.com/oz/omnizero424/badnotes.mp3 in the URL browser and click go because angelfire doesn't allow direct links from different sites I guess uh..

Oh I have a yamaha, my teacher just gave me a brand new mouthpiece that was like 60$ and she also gave me a 2 1/2 reed.

I listened to your clip. You need to learn to start your notes with a proper tongued attack. For low register on the bari, it can help to think of the beginning of each note as a "DOH".

[SAXISMYAXE]

Merlin is correct, you need to learn to tongue your notes properly. The Baritone requires a more vigorous attack than the smaller horns, especially in the lower register. I would also suggest that you are not supporting your airstream properly from the diaphragm. The Baritone is a great "acid test" to determine whether a sax player is indeed using the diaphragm properly or not. Additionally, your throat should be fully open and you should be putting plenty of air through the horn as well. It sounds to me as though you are choking off a lot of the air stream, which is contributing to a very thin, tinny sound.

[SAXISMYAXE]

Oops, sorry Bariman, I posted the above advice before I read your post. It sounds as though you covered everything I said, only much earlier than me! I'll shut up now. :oops:

[HC]

saxismyaxe, I couldn't of said it better myself. The lower the instrument, the lower your jaw and throat has to go. If you start going up an octive on the lower notes, it means that your embouschur is too tight.

Try a softer reed, and what mouthpiece are you using? Just to give you an idea on different strengths, I play Vandoren 3.5 on alto, but use 2.5 Rico (For all you Rico haters, yell at me all you want :D ) Perhaps a 2.5 is on the hard side. Also the tip opening on the mouthpiece has to do a lot with it. It is much easier to sustain a low Bb on the Selmer C* for me than on the Meyer.

[SaxyAcoustician]

Jimbob, whatever mouthpiece you use on it make sure you have a variety of reed strengths to play with (yeah, I'm aware of how expensive bari reeds are). Go with orange box Ricos because they actually work great. I've found that the fastest way to getting all the notes on bari is to have the proper strength reed--that goes for any saxophone.